Rocky vs John L Sullivan

Impossible to say.

HE Grant asked me to make a pick, of which lineal champions Sullivan would beat, and I stopped at Tommy Burns.

Beyond that, the arguments became impossible.

I skipped Jeffries, and committed to a call on the others, up to Jack Johnson.

The best that I can offer you:

They both had an offensive style, but Sullivan seemed to be the better finisher, while Marciano was the better sustained pressure fighter.

If they were around the same level, this would end badly for Marciano.

If they were not, then it would end badly for Sullivan.

 

Gloved or bareknuckle? In gloved, Rocky destroys him (just the better fighter, proven against better fighters in a much tougher era, etc), in bareknuckle its more competitive but i think Marciano was actually built for bareknuckle out of all the gloved champs and Sullivan is running into an UNFORTUNATE style matchup to go into a bareknuckle match with.

 

Following up from my requested speculations in the Sullivan thread: I could see Galento having an outside chance of beating Rocky. Consequently and by analogy, I could see Sullivan having an outside chance of beating Rocky.

More likely, Rocky by knockout.

 

Tyson said it best. 'those guys had no head movement, i'd ko all of them.'

I think rocky would do the same.

 

IMHO, with today's Rules, and John and Rocky getting a reasonable amount of time to adjust to today's environment, suitable training camps, good management/training, and with both prime:

A lot depends on what Sullivan's fighting style actually was. Many seem to think Sullivan's style resembled Patterson's. If that actually was the case, then Marciano would probably beat him, but it still might go the 12 round length of today's fights, with Marciano winning a Unanimous decision victory.

On the other hand, if Sullivan was more of a Tyson style fighter, as many think, then he might actually fight Marciano to a split decision loss over 12 rounds, in a very close fight. Both men could even visit the canvas.

Lastly, if Sullivan was more of a Liston type slugger (though, of course not exactly like Sonny), he could pull an upset and Decision Marciano over 12 rounds.

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Then again, which I think is certainly possible, Sullivan may have been a combination of all 3 styles mentioned, a sort of swarmer with some slugger mixed in (similar, but not exactly like Tyson). There's no way to be sure. I suspect that Rocky wouldn't have an easy time with John. I'll put it that way.

 

It would have been a real, in each other s face, blood and snot type war. Fascinating to watch, the two knocking chunks out of each other!!
As for a winner, I lean towards Marciano but who can really say?

 

Do you have the source?

 

Tyson never saw Sullivan fight.

 

You say " many seem to think his style resembled Patterson's " sorry buddy is that a typo ?
Never in all my years have heard or seen that opinion, a for who will win , I will go for the Rock, from what I have read back in Sullivan's day there was lots of wrestling, mauling, and throwing to the ground, they on paper appear to be around the same weight and height maybe, that being the case despite John L s nickname, cant see many fighters of the same stature as Rocky bossing him about, pushed on outcome, would pick Rocky after 8 rounds or so.
stay safe guys.

 

the qoute or footage of sullivan?

 

There is no indication that any of these guys moved their heads. they have boxing manuals in the 19th century and nothing alluded to that fact , they all fought with palms out or hands down and would clinch a lot.

 

The quote. Tyson saying that people didn't use head movement back then, and he'd beat them for that reason.

 

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It wasn't a typo. You and I probably had different elderly friends in the 60's. I heard quite a few guys say, from what they heard about Sullivan from people long gone, that he reminded them of Patterson's style of pressure fighting. Personally, I usually picture John as more of a Tyson type fighter...sort of a combination between swarming and slugging. I agree with you that boxing was very different in John's general era, so saying he resembled Patterson's pressure type style should not be taken as a carbon copy, particularly when London Prize Ring Rules were used, which also may explain the confusion in how exactly John fought in gloved matches. Even in those glove matches, I always assumed Sullivan held his hands lower than Patterson did (as most did from his era), as a carry over from the bare knuckle days, and perhaps their higher confidence in their abilities to take a punch to the head when necessary, or avoid same. There was definitely a different mind set in those days.

I also agree with you that I don't see fighters of the same stature as Rocky bossing him about in a boxing ring. That's a very good point!