SRL vs Pernel

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by Mark Dunham, Apr 17, 2022.


  1. Mark Dunham

    Mark Dunham Well-Known Member Full Member

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    Yeah Pug GUY - F*ck him!

    That disingenuous tw*at is just trying to play to the crowd

    btw, I love your quotes and I love quoting you too!

    How's this for a classic "Sugar Ray can do EVERYTHING!"

    Yeah, everything except beat Hagler, Norris & Camacho

    On the positive side, I like yourself, feel that Leonard did have versatility and actually could do a little bit on everything

    We must not forget that in GENERAL,,, Olympic gold medalists do have a bit MORE than the vast majority of even most top level champions

    This cannot be ignored

    even so, they have certain limitations and remember that Pernell too was an Olympic medalist

    and how Leonard would fare vs Pernell, is anyone's guess

    but I do know one thing; He cant beat Terry Norris. He lost every round from beginning to end
     
  2. Pugguy

    Pugguy Ingo, The Thinking Man’s GOAT banned Full Member

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    Here’s a great quote for you Red Looster:-

    “A t*rd by any other name still smells as foul.”

    Not Bard, hey? Or, how about, The Taming of the Rooster?

    Ray beat Marv. FACT. That was 35 years ago. My goodness, how many nets have you slipped through over the decades? The system has well and truly failed us.

    Dynamicpuncher is a fine poster and I said nothing to detract from that fact. I look forward to discussions with him in the future.

    Sociopathic twisting of what has actually been said doesn’t cut it. Even Terry would pity you if he ever read your “thoughts”.

    Clearly, TOO MUCH RAY for you to handle.

    As I’ve said before, Shutter Island treatment is the only recourse here. Not all bad , you get to be Leo DeCap unless you have an irrational axe to grind with him also.

    Even buy yourself a spinning top maybe - start it off and if it doesn’t eventually tip but instead keeps spinning, then you know you’re not in the world of reality and need to snap out of it, stat!
     
  3. JohnThomas1

    JohnThomas1 VIP Member

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    In my early years here i used to use red for debate practise. He had as many holes as swiss cheese but he kept coming so it gave you a chance to work on a few things. There'd be a bit of humor sneaking into it too and quite a few actually enjoyed it :lol:
     
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  4. Pugguy

    Pugguy Ingo, The Thinking Man’s GOAT banned Full Member

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    That’s a great take JT.

    Like sparring but instead training for debate, sharpen your skills and tactics on a third rater. Maybe even play the rope a dope, let them rant themselves out, no damage done except to themselves and then hit them between the eyes with a stunning counter.

    Maybe it’s time for another sea change - MD should respawn and come back under the moniker Joe Grim - takes a licking but keeps on ticking.
     
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  5. JohnThomas1

    JohnThomas1 VIP Member

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    :lol:

    You've expanded on it better than i ever could have!! That's exactly what it was.
     
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  6. Mark Dunham

    Mark Dunham Well-Known Member Full Member

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    Sorry, doesnt ring a bell. probably another fictional account by another embittered poster

    Ray beat marv?

    this was cleared up months ago if not years

    youtube video that took count of the scoring round by round and is subjective, revealing the true winner

    It was Marvin Hagler just like we said all along!

    And if the video is a subjective account of every blow scored, why take your word for it?

    Well, that settles that!

    You're really going to need more than superlatives when trying to convince the other side your point of view

    "too much Sugar Ray" tell us nothing except that PugGuy doesnt know a damn thing

    and doubling down on a mistake, wont help

    But Pugguy, just doesnt get it!

    Like you said, Sugar Ray does everything but he is not equal in all departments. that is why he was no match for Norris

    That is why it took him all of 11 rounds to down someone like a Larry Bonds when it really only should have taken three

    This deficiency is the reason he fell so far behind on the scorecards in Leonard - Hearns 1

    and although he brought down Hitman in the proverbial nick of time, let's face it, he wasn't awesome. he was merely adequate

    Marvin Hagler is the one who showed actual brilliance and was staggering in his effectiveness. the world had never seen anything like it

    but is it any wonder WHY he lost to Norris?

    While his ADEQUATE approach was ADEQUATE for Thomas Hearns, it was far from enough in dealing with better strategic fighters such as Norris or Camacho, a world champion multiple times over, who ambushed Leonard and rendered him unconscious, much like Quincy Taylor

    A great fighter would have defeated Norris despite the age difference because that's what great fighters do

    Before I go, I want to introduce you to pugilistic math

    It goes like this:

    Any fighter - ring rust = a better fighter

    This means that Ray Leonard going into the Norris fight was a better fighter than he was going into the Hagler fight because there was no ring rust

    Despite this fact, he still could not come close to competing with Norris

    Despite the fact that he was again competing at his best weight - the added on bulk that slowed him down, he was no match for Norris

    to certify his greatness, all Leonard would need to silence his crtics, would be to defeat the younger Norris

    PS: if i were a betting man, I would pick Pernell to outpoint Leonard
     
  7. Pugguy

    Pugguy Ingo, The Thinking Man’s GOAT banned Full Member

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    Hmmmm, …....sorry to tell you but the shot clock timed out on this and there was far too much dribbling (not least over Norris) beforehand anyway. Consider yourself slam dunked.
     
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  8. Mark Dunham

    Mark Dunham Well-Known Member Full Member

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    I don't know what you're crowing about. Did Leonard ever beat Norris?

    Ray Leonard was way overmatched against "Too much TERRY NORRIS"
     
    Last edited: Apr 29, 2022
  9. Pugguy

    Pugguy Ingo, The Thinking Man’s GOAT banned Full Member

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    Though a humble man, I have plenty to boast about.

    I don’t crow, that’s Looster speak - YOUR speak - the poster who knows far TOO little.

    Get it RIGHT, it’s TOO MUCH RAY, you little plagiarist you. It only takes two neurones to spark an original thought. Perhaps that is two TOO many for you.

    YOU keep sticking your beak out and it keeps getting knocked off, such is the poultry nature of your posts.

    How many rounds did it take 7-1 favourite Norris to beat Keith Mullings who’d only won about 1 fight in last 4? Ah, that’s right, Terry didn’t stop him, did he? In fact, I seem to recall that it was Terry who was stopped.

    TOO little Norris and TOO little Looster. Hahaha.

    Now for that Shutter Island treatment. Take a walk down this hospital ward.

    [url]https://www.boxingforum24.com/threads/sugar-ray-leonard-v-terry-norris-prime-for-prime.570278/page-56[/url]

    We need to ease you in. Due to PTSD you will initially reject that it’s you - but it is YOU “Mark”, even if you can’t remember, having pushed your prior history deep down into your unconscious mind.

    YOU will plainly see the unmistakable similarities (they’re identical really) in the conduct of, and the opinions expressed, in your previous posts (as Foghorn) and current posts under your “new”, heavily disguised persona - LOL.

    In short, it’s the same old cr*p from the same old poster who knows far TOO little….a truly deluded and broken record.

    Did you buy that top I mentioned? …..

    I have to assume it hasn’t tipped but is instead is still “inexplicably” spinning. Mark, Rooster and/or whatever other personalities you’ve adopted, time to snap out of it man.
     
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  10. Mark Dunham

    Mark Dunham Well-Known Member Full Member

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    I'm sorry sir but you have no bragging rights since your man did not beat Norris

    Only IF he had beat him, could you do it

    Similar to the SI article covering the match.

    The writer would not so much as mention the fight itself, preferring to steer away from the details, and them calling it a 4 point difference in the scoring

    He of course wasn't serious but left readers the impression that he was. Writers write whatever they want the readers to think

    I on the other hand, DO have every reason to laud Norris and downgrade Leonard

    Older fighters are SUPPOSED to be able to turn back young, fast challengers. Hagler did it time and again. It was said that he ruined more young fighters than leggy red heads

    Thanks for the read. I think RedRooster made a very good point; Why DID it take Leonard 11 rounds to dispose of an untalented non threat like Bonds?

    this PERFECTLY illustrates my point!

    His performances against movers such as Bonds was lacking and believe me, I was rooting for Ray to do better

    "come on Ray, you can do it!!"

    "just a little more effort!"

    "Too much Ray" became "barely adequate Ray" in the Bonds & Hearns fights of '81 which is no surprise the Norris fight was so one sided

    As i said, Norris was PURE SPEED and no one could touch him that night. He was so gifted, so fast! He made inning big fights look so easy
     
  11. Pugguy

    Pugguy Ingo, The Thinking Man’s GOAT banned Full Member

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    Ah, the sound of one man cr*pping.

    If a tree fell in the woods……would we be lucky enough for it to fall on………?, ah never mind.

    Ray stopped Bonds in round 10. You were corrected on that point back then - what?, it’s about 6 years on and you’re still unable to acquire and maintain accurate information, even when it’s spoonfed.

    Problematic to say the least.

    Yes, I remember Marv Hags comprehensively turning back that uber active, young gun Ray Leonard - great stuff. Totally destroyed Ray’s career, didn’t he? Damn shame that.

    And vs Mullings, Terry really did live up to his nick “Terrible” didn’t he? Wow. If only they served him up a young up and comer with an unbeaten record or near enough to. It would’ve been easy peasy. Tezza would’ve surely smashed that hot prospect and put paid to his career.

    Instead, Terrible Tezza took the harder road and faced Mullings. Nothing like that “soft touch” Leonard facing and beating Hearns.

    Maybe I should pay you double for your sparring services - sure, you’re a 4th rater but an amazing sponge for punishment all the same. Are you a big fan of Joe Grim per chance too?

    I’m a bit surprised that your “facility” allows you access to devices to go on to social media platforms and “interact”.

    I mean, it’s good I suppose for your “socialisation” but maybe it would be better if they restricted your communications to people from “like facilities”.

    There’d be at least a better chance of you guys making “sense” of one another.

    Here’s a fella I could hook you up with to talk boxing. He really knows his stuff, enough at least for you to feel well challenged:-

    This content is protected
     
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  12. Mark Dunham

    Mark Dunham Well-Known Member Full Member

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    And on tape, the Leonard that was pitted vs Norris
    No thanks. your ideas never pan out

    I never said Marvin, or what was left of him, destroyed him. This was never my concern, nor did I bring it up

    I leave the destruction to Norris & Camacho who did the evil deed. I bet guys like you and Louden still have nightmares over it too

    but this is NOT my concern!

    My concern is the disturbing fact that Ray somehow took 11 rounds just for Larry Bonds. His own trainer heard telling him "you realize you have a stiff in front of you"

    There is a HUGE difference between the picture you paint of "too much Ray" and the one we see on tape

    What was merely "adequate" for Bonds was not adequate for the likes of Nunn, Norris, or Pernell (voted greatest southpaw ever)

    If Ray was merely adequate in disposing of what Dundee himself labels as "a stiff", then these same deficiencies were never corrected and carried over against Norris

    and against this level of competition, these flaws finally did him in

    So I can rightfully use the bout with Norris as a projection of what would likely happen vs other talented boxers

    if he cant handle Norris, it's also likely that he will fail against Pernell in an evening of frustration. He will fail as he did vs another ONCE talented southpaw, Hector Camacho

    I just figure that a talented writer like you with so much to say, could do more than just offer a glowing endorsement as an emotional appeal or try not to get off track without resorting to childish rants
     
  13. ETM

    ETM I thought I did enough to win. Full Member

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    I scored Norris/Leonard for Ray close. The Sugar Man by a whisker.
     
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  14. he grant

    he grant Historian/Film Maker

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    Is your point that Norris beat a near prime Leonrd and was a better fighter than Ray ?
     
  15. Pugguy

    Pugguy Ingo, The Thinking Man’s GOAT banned Full Member

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    You did bring Hags into it as an analogy in an attempt to falsely underrate/denigrate Leonard. Ray stopped Bonds in 10 NOT 11. So many flaws in your game.

    There are no emotional appeals, only logical. There’s been no infantile posting from this end - but you yourself have made numerous submissions that reside very much in that realm.

    You’ve been accommodated with being taken seriously but you’ve blown it time and again.

    You totally ignore irrefutable counter points with black and white evidence in tow - and the criterion you apply to Ray, you blatantly do not apply to the fighters that you PERSONALLY favour.

    With only 1 fight in 5 years prior to, Ray fought infrequently since the Hags fight at which time he was already 30. Even Norris identified Ray’s OBVIOUS deteriorations BEFORE they fought. Ferdie Pacheco identified Ray’s further deteriorations during the course of the fight - as did ALL the post fight write ups.

    Prime Ray would be far TOO MUCH RAY for Norris -who was what, about 30 yo when a none too compelling challenger, 7-1 underdog, Mullings cleaned his clock?

    Post seriously and maybe you’ll be taken seriously, otherwise, don’t moan in all hypocrisy.

    I don’t have any boxing related nightmares or obsessive compulsive attachments to fighters I personally like or dislike.

    Of course I can’t speak for Loudon but as he carries himself, I doubt that he does also.

    And why bring up Loudon when he isn’t posting on this right now? - see how your duality and hypocrisy just keep giving.

    About the only potential nightmare I can imagine is checking message alerts and seeing yet another reply from Mark Dunham - enough to make anyone wake up in a lather of sweat. Hahahehe.

    C’mon Mark, all good fun - if you can’t stand the heat (that you turned up), then get out of the kitchen.
     
    Last edited: May 1, 2022
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