This thread arises from an interesting issue @Gazelle Punch brought up in another thread. All credit to him for raising the question. We have a hypothetical fight between Liston and Rahman. 12 rounds. Liston comes in at 6'1", 213 pounds. Rahman comes in at 6'2", 238 pounds. (Both men might be lying about their heights.) Does either fighter have a size advantage? Why or why not?
Depends what one thinks in terms of size. Is it weight? Reach? Height? Modern fighters are terribly dishonest about height. Just as are most modern athletes. Think the nba dropped an average of like an inch and a half when they started measuring without shoes. Modern workout methods allow for added bulk. Rahman weighs considerably less in a past era. Just as Liston could weigh considerably more in a later era.
By "size advantage," I mean the same type of advantage that fighters from larger weight classes enjoy over fighters from smaller weight classes. It's a fuzzy combination of stuff like weight, height, reach, etc. Maxim had a size advantage over Ray Robinson, for example.
I think so. That said, gee if ever there were a "Champion" who wouldn't hear the 2nd round bell against Liston, Rahman is it imo.
Rahman is definitely the bigger fighter. Rahman turned pro at 22 years old weighing 234 pounds and his reach is listed at 82". He fought 61 times and only fought 7 fighters who weighed less than 210 pounds. He scored 5 knockouts in those 7 fights, stopping 4 of them in the first round, another in the 4th, and two of them went the distance with him. One, a much more experienced fighter in Rahman's 4th pro fight which was a 4 rounder, the other was Marion Wilson who went 10. Rahman might have had a Liston type reputation if he came along in the 50s-60s and enjoyed a huge size advantage over his opponents.
Emmanuel Stewart said Rahman had some of the biggest hands/fists he ever saw also the don't mess with me advantage is highly debatable. Rahman wasn't no choir boy and his background is well documented.
Rahman is bigger but people are gonna somehow make sure that Liston comes out in this advantage although it's really no big deal.
Like Liston, Hasim was an enforcer for drug gangs, has been shot numerous times and hails from the Capitol of Badazzes, Baltimore MD. I don't think Sonny has anything on him as far as intimidation. Perhaps the difference is in who each was trying to intimidate.
Exactly. I've never been around a fighter who was afraid of his opponent. Some are nervous/afraid that they won't perform as well as they are capable...but fighting an opponent with a referee present doesn't scare them. We had one fighter who we'd have to wake up so that he could loosen up before a fight. He always said, "it's just a boxing match, the guy's not going to have a gun or knife, he can't even kick me if I go down, there is nothing to be nervous about." He and others we had would occasionally have an opponent who tried to "mean mug" them before the fight. That gave them confidence because they interpreted that as meaning the opponent lacked heart, was trying to pump himself up, and would fold quick after getting hit. Most fighters come from backgrounds where they have experienced much worse than a "stare." If they were afraid of everybody who "mean mugged" them they wouldn't leave their house.
In boxing opponent are not intimidated by gang enforcer history & whatever. they are sometimes intimidated by the pure ability of delivering boxing beating & consistent KO at high level. fighter like Mohammad Ali & Roy Jones & Mike Tyson & Sonny Liston & Lennox Lewis & Thomas Hearns & Evander Holyfield & Joe Frazier and many so many other. of course they are intimidation master! any opponent with "piece of doubt" against such rival can melt down a bit even a little from the intimidate factor.
