Michael Spinks vs Sonny Liston @ HW

Spinks had never faced a fighter like Tyson, Spinks couldn`t out-speed Tyson who was a lot quicker than Holmes 85-88 and Cooney.

 

Spinks = too slow & knees wrapping
= no chance to do running game plan
impossible

 

Excellent info JT!

I posted on another forum years ago that MS was scared - the uniform response was that MS always looked somewhat fearful before fights and that was just how MS looked - in part that was a justified perception.

However, I added in my post that I’d read a boxing mag. IV with MS - I think it was pre fight - and MS basically outlined the fear he held, including in regard to his actual health - and that it wasn’t worth putting that on the line for a fight.

I couldn’t remember the mag. in question - and despite the extensive knowledge of the members of that particular forum, no one else had read same - they were cool though, they didn’t necessarily doubt me - but it was super annoying that I couldn’t remember which mag. - I guessed KO mag. but I’d turfed my collection some time prior so I couldn’t say for sure.

Also liked your rhyming slang - “Have another Captain Cook”. LOL.

Instead of getting in the ring to face Tyson, maybe MS should’ve “Done the Harold Holt”. Ha.

 

I am starting to think for Sonny to win early he has to be as fast as Tyson. And Sonny really wasn’t.

I still think Sonny catches up with Spinks eventually because people forget Spinks was already nearing the end of his career by the time embarked on his heavyweight career.

One thing staying away from a tired Larry and another thing staying away from a prime Sonny.

 

I totally agree. Tyson was a light heavyweights biggest nightmare. Not only was he so powerful and aggressive but he was so damn fast as well. There was no-where to go.

 

Have a Captain Cook has been an Aussie saying since i was a kid. Sky Rocket = pocket, Johnny Raper = newspaper etc.

I completely believe you and am pretty sure i rad the same at some point.

What i also read but can't find was Spinks, replying to a reporter who was asking him when are you going to face Tyson, saying words to the effect of why don't YOU fight him etc and being quite open about his trepidation.

 

Spinks was a "far better" heavyweight than Machen? Really?

Tangstad? Put the billy down chok. The version of Cooney that Spinks fought? That was the worst version of a matured Cooney we ever saw in the ring and it is the one fight he is extremely unhappy about.

Old slow Holmes caught up with Spinks multiple times but lacked the youth to finish him. Imagine what happens when the livelier younger far more powerful Liston catches him up.

Sonny has the edge? No ****.

 

Tangstad was decent. A European champion. He drew with Buster Douglas and beat Joe Bugner. He’s at least as good as say Bert white hurst who went the distance with Sonny.

That maybe so. But Spinks was good that night. Cooney was coming off that win over the rated Eddie Gregg.

Spinks beat Larry Holmes. Whatever way you look at it Eddie Machen was never going to do that.

I agree. Sonny does have the edge.

 

I should have been clearer, I meant specifically the Tyson haters that try to downplay his great win over Spinks, are idiots. My apologies if I offended anyone.

Having said that, I still don't agree with you.....Tyson was all over him, what else could Spinks have done? Mike was so quick coming in, Spinks would have literally had to run to avoid him. What could MS have done differently, to show he wasn't fighting scared?

 

Hey no worries at all. I do see it downplayed by quite a few, absolutely.

Just to be clear i haven't put all of my eggs in any basket and have said i'm partial to both views.

Also to keep it simple Spinks could have come in barely able to walk from fear and i would still give 100% credit. We have a guy that refuses to give Liston due credit because Patterson was supposedly scared and unable to perform how he usually would. Boo hoo - if guys are that intimidating well full credit to them!

Anyway gun to my head I'd opt for a combination of both reasons. some of us have seen Spinks comments in the proceeding months on Tyson and we also have Stewards words i quoted above. I have no doubt he had feelings going on that he'd never had before. I'd also, however, acknowledge what a brute Tyson was, particularly in the opening minutes. He was like a heat seeking missile early on particularly against guys that couldn't tie him up or lean on him.

So that's me. I think it's a very fair and sensible take.

 

Context is everything. Bugner was mid 30's and had lost to Marvis Frazier a year prior who had just 9 fights under his belt. On top of this many thought Bugner deserved the nod and Tangstad was the beneficiary of a hometown decision .

Douglas had all of 11 fights under his belt and had already been stopped by Bey. Lets not pretend this is some sort of barometer, at all. Douglas was heavier than he was for Holyfield for heavens sake.

Neither were anywhere near the top 10.

Whitehurst going the distance with Liston has nothing to do with Tangstad's standing.

Gregg was alphabet rated but miles off a ring rating.....because he wasn't much chop. He'd already lost to Broad and Cooney beating him wasn't much of anything. We knew he could punch. Gregg was a lamb to the slaughter. That's how Cooney's team rolled.

A top win but it doesn't make him a "far better" heavyweight than Machen.

Do i need to add "Sherlock" this time.