Is Frazier win over Ali overrated?

Discussion in 'World Boxing Forum' started by Thecheckjab, Jun 8, 2022.

  1. Thecheckjab

    Thecheckjab Active Member Full Member

    Joined:
    Mar 15, 2018
    Messages:
    528
    Likes Received:
    667
    If Ali didn't go to prison in 1967 and instead stayed active do you think he would have beaten Frazier in 1970?

    Is Frazier's win over Ali overrated because Ali had been 3 years out of the ring?
     
    Richard M Murrieta likes this.
  2. Rollin

    Rollin Boxing Addict Full Member

    Joined:
    Nov 17, 2021
    Messages:
    4,185
    Likes Received:
    6,674
    Frazier's victory was very decisive. If he only clutched a SD/MD, then one could entertain the thought of it being overrated.
     
  3. Philly161

    Philly161 "Fundamentals are the crutch of the talentless" banned Full Member

    Joined:
    Oct 25, 2020
    Messages:
    1,669
    Likes Received:
    2,271
    Ali didn't go to prison he lost his liscense and was facing the possibility of jail if he lost his case but he won. Ali had already been back a year and won 2 fights against ranked world level guys quarry and bonavena. That plus what Ali went on to do for many years after to me shows that Frazier's win in FOTC was truly a great achievement.
     
  4. DavidC77

    DavidC77 Well-Known Member Full Member

    Joined:
    Aug 30, 2018
    Messages:
    1,923
    Likes Received:
    1,618
    Given that Ali was coming back from a three year layoff and had only two fights before facing Frazier, it's clear that he was not ready for a fighter of Frazier's calibre and Ali was not the fighter he once was.

    But it was still a very impressive performance by Frazier but he wouldn't have beaten a prime Ali.
     
  5. Boxed Ears

    Boxed Ears this my daddy's account (RIP daddy) Full Member

    Joined:
    Jul 28, 2009
    Messages:
    56,070
    Likes Received:
    10,482
    Muhammad Ali went to PRISON for committing unspeakable forms of serial assault on first an 18-year-old girl (almost a child, legally) named Desiree Washington, followed by Margie Schoedinger, Maria Halpin, Selene Walters and Juanita Broaddrick. If only you'd read what he did to them you'd know without reading any further that he must have gone to prison for it. Ali...was not a good guy in this story. Frazier and his brother Niles are the good guys here.
     
    Pat M, Holler, ShovelHook and 2 others like this.
  6. Philly161

    Philly161 "Fundamentals are the crutch of the talentless" banned Full Member

    Joined:
    Oct 25, 2020
    Messages:
    1,669
    Likes Received:
    2,271
    For a sec you had me
     
  7. Boxed Ears

    Boxed Ears this my daddy's account (RIP daddy) Full Member

    Joined:
    Jul 28, 2009
    Messages:
    56,070
    Likes Received:
    10,482
    I could make a future effort to be more subtle. I'm not sure it would be a good thing but...
     
    Philly161, Holler and mark ant like this.
  8. miniq

    miniq AJ IS A BODYBUILDING BUM Full Member

    Joined:
    Oct 23, 2011
    Messages:
    47,839
    Likes Received:
    27,790
    Frazier was Ali's poison.
     
    Reinhardt likes this.
  9. exocet76

    exocet76 Boxing Junkie Full Member

    Joined:
    Feb 28, 2012
    Messages:
    11,334
    Likes Received:
    17,550
    Nah it's a great win.
    Ali never went to prison and did have a couple of tune up fights. Yeah he wasn't as light on his feet on his return but he adapted and had many great wins after. Joe was clearly very determined in that fight after all the smack talk beforehand.
     
  10. mark ant

    mark ant Canelo was never athletic Full Member

    Joined:
    May 4, 2017
    Messages:
    36,654
    Likes Received:
    16,562
    Left hooks were Ali`s poison.
     
    SwarmingSlugger and ShovelHook like this.
  11. Rumsfeld

    Rumsfeld Moderator Staff Member

    Joined:
    Jul 19, 2004
    Messages:
    49,518
    Likes Received:
    15,936
    Overrated? It's arguably the single greatest victory in heavyweight history.
     
  12. Richmondpete

    Richmondpete Real fighters do road work Full Member

    Joined:
    Oct 22, 2015
    Messages:
    7,140
    Likes Received:
    5,026
    You make it sound like they literally unlocked Ali's cell door the week of the fight
     
    Holler likes this.
  13. Dubblechin

    Dubblechin Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

    Joined:
    Jun 25, 2014
    Messages:
    24,640
    Likes Received:
    18,438
    Ali came off a three-year retirement and beat the WBA #3 contender Jerry Quarry, two months later beat the WBA #1 contender Oscar Bonavena, ... three months after that he fought Frazier .. and about four months after the Frazier fight, Ali beat the WBA #2 contender Jimmy Ellis.

    That's a pretty remarkable nine-month sprint ... facing the top three contenders and the world champion.

    So it's a little difficult to say Ali wasn't ready for Frazier.

    He stopped the #1, #2 and #3 contenders ... he just lost to Frazier in a brutal fight.
     
  14. Fourth_Horseman

    Fourth_Horseman Member Full Member

    Joined:
    May 12, 2022
    Messages:
    259
    Likes Received:
    416
    -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


    The version of Ali that fought Frazier was no longer Prime Ali. He had the hand speed but not the mobility. Frazier would have had a very difficult time cornering Prime Ali and if he did, the exchange would not favor him. Ali was probably ready but his arsenal was not as formidable.
     
    Azania likes this.
  15. jmb1356

    jmb1356 Well-Known Member Full Member

    Joined:
    Sep 30, 2019
    Messages:
    1,826
    Likes Received:
    1,904
    Anything but.