Liston v Marciano's Top Opposition?

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by Liston73, Jul 6, 2022.


Page 5 of 6
  1. SuzieQ49

    SuzieQ49 The Manager Full Member

    37,088
    3,779
    Sep 14, 2005
    everyone knows chokelab has a man crush on 50s euro heavyweights and dislikes the American heavyweights of the late 50s
     
    SuzieQ49, Jul 7, 2022
    SuzieQ49, Jul 7, 2022
    #61
    Liston73 and swagdelfadeel like this.
  2. swagdelfadeel

    swagdelfadeel Obsessed with Boxing

    19,489
    21,519
    Jul 30, 2014
    :lol: You ain’t wrong there pal!
     
    swagdelfadeel, Jul 7, 2022
    swagdelfadeel, Jul 7, 2022
    #62
    Liston73 likes this.
  3. Liston73

    Liston73 Active Member banned Full Member

    866
    675
    Jun 8, 2022
    Suzie I'd love for you to make a thread on them so we can debate them at length.
    Please,please do so!
     
    Liston73, Jul 8, 2022
    Liston73, Jul 8, 2022
    #63
  4. SuzieQ49

    SuzieQ49 The Manager Full Member

    37,088
    3,779
    Sep 14, 2005
    i don’t need to. I see Marcianos top opponents on film. They look great. Nothing more needs to be said. You vastly underrate them
     
    SuzieQ49, Jul 8, 2022
    SuzieQ49, Jul 8, 2022
    #64
    RockyJim likes this.
  5. Liston73

    Liston73 Active Member banned Full Member

    866
    675
    Jun 8, 2022
    Well I was watching them on Super8mm before you were hatched!
    I think Liston gets Louis,Charles, Walcott ,Layne,Lastarza, out of there quicker than Marciano .
    He was more accurate with his punches,stronger ,bigger and had the big advantage of an all time great jab to soften them up with.
    Unlike Rocky he would be bigger than all of them, and its my contention that neither Walcott or Moore would drop a prime Liston. That is not underating them, its how I see their respective styles and where they were in their careers at that time versus a H2H monster.
    Sorry if that gets under your skin ,but its my honest opinion. Why don't you post how you think those prospective matches would go ? I'd like to see them?

    You've made a sweeping statement now justify it? Sincere request!
     
    Liston73, Jul 8, 2022
    Liston73, Jul 8, 2022
    #65
  6. SuzieQ49

    SuzieQ49 The Manager Full Member

    37,088
    3,779
    Sep 14, 2005
    I rate Sonny Liston as my # 6 heavyweight of all time. That is probably higher than 95% of where people rate him.

    I've never once argued Liston would lose to any of Marciano's opponents.

    I've never once argued Liston would lose to Marciano.

    I will say, tho for certain, you underrate Marciano's competition big time.
     
    SuzieQ49, Jul 8, 2022
    SuzieQ49, Jul 8, 2022
    #66
    RockyJim, choklab, Gazelle Punch and 1 other person like this.
  7. BitPlayerVesti

    BitPlayerVesti Boxing Drunkie Full Member

    8,581
    11,093
    Oct 28, 2017
    Using this logic Jeffries is vastly better than Jack Johnson
     
    BitPlayerVesti, Jul 9, 2022
    BitPlayerVesti, Jul 9, 2022
    #67
    cross_trainer and 70sFan865 like this.
  8. 70sFan865

    70sFan865 Boxing Junkie Full Member

    8,547
    9,593
    May 30, 2019
    Don't tell him that!
     
    70sFan865, Jul 9, 2022
    70sFan865, Jul 9, 2022
    #68
    cross_trainer likes this.
  9. SuzieQ49

    SuzieQ49 The Manager Full Member

    37,088
    3,779
    Sep 14, 2005
    Yes. I’d like to point out a few facts

    1. Despite being 38 years old when they fought Marciano, both walcott and Moore were current world champions.

    2. Despite being 38 years old when they fought Marciano, walcott and Moore both defeated one of multiple hall of famers (Charles 2, Johnson, Olsen) and ring # 1 heavyweight contender (Valdes, Charles) in the past year leading into the Marciano fight.

    So “prime” or not who cares! Both were still fantastic fighters
     
    SuzieQ49, Jul 9, 2022
    SuzieQ49, Jul 9, 2022
    #69
    BitPlayerVesti, Gazelle Punch, 70sFan865 and 3 others like this.
  10. choklab

    choklab cocoon of horror Full Member

    27,676
    7,669
    Dec 31, 2009
    Correct.

    As I said earlier, it’s best to compare champions once they are good enough to hit the ratings.

    Crazy picking out fights from a developing apprenticeship because it fits numerically with a fully qualified contenders career!
     
    choklab, Jul 9, 2022
    choklab, Jul 9, 2022
    #70
    RockyJim, BitPlayerVesti and cross_trainer like this.
  11. RockyJim

    RockyJim Boxing Addict Full Member

    5,261
    2,477
    Mar 26, 2005
    Love it!!!
     
    RockyJim, Jul 9, 2022
    RockyJim, Jul 9, 2022
    #71
    choklab likes this.
  12. RockyJim

    RockyJim Boxing Addict Full Member

    5,261
    2,477
    Mar 26, 2005
    He sure does...
     
    RockyJim, Jul 9, 2022
    RockyJim, Jul 9, 2022
    #72
    choklab likes this.
  13. Liston73

    Liston73 Active Member banned Full Member

    866
    675
    Jun 8, 2022
    An unbiased quote.LOL!
     
    Liston73, Jul 10, 2022
    Liston73, Jul 10, 2022
    #73
  14. Liston73

    Liston73 Active Member banned Full Member

    866
    675
    Jun 8, 2022
     
    Liston73, Jul 10, 2022
    Liston73, Jul 10, 2022
    #74
  15. Liston73

    Liston73 Active Member banned Full Member

    866
    675
    Jun 8, 2022
    That is certainly NOT what I am doing. I am responding to a poster stating that in comparison to Liston, Marciano was fast tracked. I cannot see how that could be misconstrued at all!
    That is a silly remark. But I'll take the obvious bait. We are not debating who was the better champion ,we are switching their opponents at the same stage of their careers not comparing their respective greatness.
    For the record
    Jeffries won the title in14 fights at the age of 24 from a 36 years old man who had not fought for 2 years.
    Johnson won the title after 62 fights at the age of 30 against a 27 years old man who had been defending his title regularly.
    This may have escaped you, but you cannot win a title if you are not allowed to fight for it, ie , if two of the last three champions refuse to defend against you. Is there anyone who seriously believes that Johnson could not have won the title earlier had he been given the opportunity?
    Its akin to thinking Archie Moore could not have been light heavyweight champ years prior to when he won it, if the paper champs preceding him had the guts and principles to defend
    against him.
     
    Last edited: Jul 11, 2022
    Liston73, Jul 10, 2022
    Liston73, Jul 10, 2022
    #75
    swagdelfadeel likes this.
Page 5 of 6