Usyk or prime Ali: More exceptional movement?

Usyk fundamentally is far superior. Ali didn’t get by because he was a better boxer. If you were a trainer you’d want your fighter to look more like Usyk then Muhammad.

 

Wouldn’t say Ali had exceptional movement in terms of using movement as a specific fight strategy. He just had exceptional fast foot speed especially prime 1960s Ali. By the 1970s his feet slowed down which is why he had to show what a great chin he had because his defensive skills had always been speed and reflexes rather than calculated feet movements and evasive angles.

It’s gotta be Usyk who gets my vote.

 

Ali,definitely. Not just his style of movement but for the freakish speed for a heavyweight.

 

Prime Ali before the exile, for me.

 

an after his exile?

 

Yeah an don’t forget he’s still doing it today at 35 years old and some 30 pounds over his natural and best fighting weight. Ali’s movement was like non existent at 35

 

They are so different I don't think anyone could truly say one was better.

Ali eas more athleticism based as he was faster but he for the most part was moving laterally.

Uysk while not as fast as Ali is more versatile with his footwork and certainly his punch selection while moving in and out, side to side even pressing through angles. Another thing to pay attention to is how they deploy their defense off of their footwork.

Ali is a guy that will drive most boxing trainers crazy with how he would pull straight back which is a huge no no but he could get away with it because if his insane reflexes.

Uysk doesn't pull back he slips and feights almost constantly. Again, one of the more interesting guys to watch because his skillset is something you simply don't see in this weightclass.

 

Well if nothing else he has proved the point Ali fans have been arguing by going 3-0 against big modern HWs while being the same size as Ali after a large meal and no freakish power. Really a victory for the art of boxing, it was funny to see AJ asking him (rhetorically I believe) "well how did you beat me? You're not strong!"

There is a tendency for boxers to look like invincible gods until they run into another god and all of a sudden the flaws become apparent.

I have to reserve judgment until he fights Fury. As good as soon of these wins are that he has, depth of skill and education has been something that many of these opponents were questioned about even before losing to Usyk.

Everything I've read about when Ali fought suggests that there was an idea that boxing was about foot and body movement as much or more than it was about throwing a punch. It seems like today the idea is to refine a punch that will blow an opponent out, make it come out faster, harder, more accurate, etc.

If this is all true, Ali's movement was going up against opponents with anti-movement skills. Usyk's opponents, maybe not.

We know Fury can move and he's studied the game and knows what he needs to do. Fury's skills were measured against Wlad, so we'll have a very good understanding of where Usyk stands historically after that fight. Can't judge him too harshly if he loses to a guy who weighs 50lbs more, but we can see how it looks at least.

 

Usyk seems to have a supercomputer in his head, how to position himself in angles where he is untouchable by the opponent (the supercomputer also controls the footwork).
Muhammad Ali has a fluidity in his movements (pre-1967 Muhammad Ali) that produces the same results as the Usyk movement.
Only to me Muhammad Ali movement is more beautiful to see.

 

I do not think a supercomputer would lose any rounds to Dereck Chisora but yeah Usyk is pretty good with his feet

 

Usyk is way superior yes every boxer is flawed but ali was able to get away with that stuff cause of the era he would be caught by shots by good trained updated fighter from these 00s

for doing that same stuff he did even in his 60s form he was to flawed to make it this gen and be at the top

Doesn't really make sense to compare these 2

 

Usyk was far more lighter on his feet 4 years ago vs Gassiev.

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They serve entirely different purposes that it's really hard to compare them and come to a conclusion. They both rely on a great gas tank and are handy for what they're trying to do. In the end it depends on what you would rather have.

Usyk is an agressive mover, coming forward to make his opponent reluctant to throw shots with conviction, thus allowing Usyk to take control of the pace far more easily, it also allows him to change his range and angles almost instantaneously. But I suspect Usyk is vulnerable to profficient agression that breaks the rhythm he gains thanks to his movement (Kinda like Loma) . His defense is great for a man his size, but almost like Ray Robinson, he mostly relies on his legs to get him out of punching range, rarely relying on more traditional defensive techniques while on the backfoot. This could be problematic against someone who knows how to corner him on the ropes, allowing very little space for Usyk to save himself since his defense probably won't be anything other than an earmuff or other basic defensive techniques (Hope I'm proven wrong though).

Ali's movement is less technically accurate than Usyk's, crossing his legs, always being airbone and leaning back from hits. That would be suicide in most cases, which is why no one moves like Ali today. Ali himself though was a different story, his sense of distance and timing was uncanny. He knew the exact range he had to be in, and could make someone miss by a fraction and come back to punish him for it. That is probably the most important skill to learn in all of Boxing, and Ali did it better than any man his size. Add his gifts like his foot speed, Ring IQ and stamina and things get even better, him being airbone is almost meaningless now due to his stamina, his foot speed allowed him to make technical mistakes and his ring IQ can make him adjust very well in fights where his movement fails him ( 70's Ali ). It does have it's weaknesses as well though, unlike Usyk he doesn't set any type of pressure to gain control of the pace in the fight, which could trouble him early in fights before he figures his opponent out (like against Mildenburger). It also leaves him incredibly vulnerable to someone who can fight well on the inside, the moment he stops being at center ring and on the ropes against a capable infighter, things could get really difficult for him.