Who is the man at heavy...Usyk or Fury?

You really couldn't.

Dubois was considered a prospect. Some thought he possessed the potential to be a big player in the division, but nobody was crediting him with having actually achieved that status at the time he faced Joyce. At best, there was a mild industry buzz that the bout would represent a coming-out party for DDD, but it only ended up confirming that expectations had been set too high. Even now, two years on, he isn't rated Top 10.

During Fury's hiatus, Wilder was widely considered Joshua's chief rival — the entire industry was champing at the bit for Joshua-Wilder through the first half of 2018, a demand which reached fever pitch after Wilder took Ortiz out in March and Joshua limped to a points win over Parker later the same month, until Fury stepped into the breach and did what Hearn and Joshua had been too busy stalling to do for themselves.

I mean, maybe you really do believe the scalp of Nathan Gorman is equivalent to that of Luis Ortiz (who was highly rated heading into 2018), but I think you know that your comparison wasn't remotely apt.

 

Luis Ortiz is really unproven. I get that some people rate him highly but he has very very little in terms of impressive wins. Its difficult for me to see that as a really impressive win for Wilder given Ortiz lack of credentials.

As far as Wilder being perceived as a rival to Joshua that seems to be based more on conjecture than actual accomplishments. Wilder might well beat Joshua but that's true of other guys. Someone like Bakole might have an excellent shot at beating Joshua or Wilder himself

 

Obliterating a Jennings who had given Wlad his trickiest fight for years in his prior performance (winning 3–4 rounds on most observers' scorecards) is certainly a much higher credential than knocking out Nathan Gorman.

Dubois has never been considered one of the top contenders in the division, but Ortiz was at the time Wilder knocked him out.

Dubois possessing the potential to be a top guy was/is the epitome of conjecture. Wilder being Joshua's chief rival in Fury's temporary absence was industry consensus in the first half of 2018.

 

This. It's mind boggling to think that a win over Wilder means your the man. He's genuinely overrated.

 

You are reaching big time.

 

We've got a guy making an analogy between Deontay Wilder and his seven defenses from 2015–2018 and a green Daniel Dubois whose career highlight was knocking out Nathan Gorman, but I'm reaching? Okay, then.

Literally everything I stated in that post is true.

 

most of these guys did pick Wilder to brutally defeat Fury, once, sometimes twice.

now they say they don't see what's so good about beating Wilder.

 

More than that, they act like he was never a Top 10 fighter, let alone Top 3. Analogous to a green Daniel Dubois.

This is when you know pure hatred is involved.

 

Beating Wilder doesn't mean you're the man of the division. Stop it.

 

But beating Joshua does?

Fury dethroned the man who had reigned as lineal king for seventy-seven months, which made him the man of the division, then he emboldened his status by demolishing the man who had emerged as Joshua's chief rival while he was away from the sport. You cannot deconstruct or get around that.

Usyk will have the opportunity to prove that he's the best next year. It's not far away. If you're so convinced that he will exert superiority over Fury when they meet in a ring, it shouldn't cut you so deeply to give Fury the credit he deserves until then.

King of the Heavyweight Division, Tyson Luke Fury. You may not like it, but you've got to deal with it. Your great hope gets his chance soon enough.

 

Now you're talking about Wlad. I'm talking strictly about Wilder.

If you mean a man who beat most of the top 10 (AJ) and someone who beat one guy in the top 10 (Wilder), its clear beating AJ would mean you're the man. We all know this.

Fury beat the man and then failed a test, so he wasn't champ and the only reason he was undefeated was because he was inactive. People talk about that length of time like Tyson HADNT failed a test and has been undefeated since then.

Usyk holds three belts. Has borderline done what Tyson has done but in 4 fights whilst it took Tyson nearly a decade to do it. You are utterly clueless.

 

when Fury beats Usyk
Joyce will be the hope for these guys
while they consume their own souls with all this hatred
it is so transparent

 

When Fury beats Usyk I'm going to post non-stop about how size matters. All my animated charts will come back out for all to see. And I will take my bow. Classic will never hear the end of it. Mwahahahaha

 

size matters
Usyk's greatness doesn't rest on him being able to beat Inoue, for example.

on the other hand
if you're good enough you're big enough .
so anyone picking Usyk to beat Fury can't use size as an excuse when it turns out the other way.

 

If AJ's a bigger puncher than Wlad because he dropped him more or stopped him then Ali and Young are bigger punchers than Foreman by the same logic.

Wlad was also, if not at his best, then at least far closer to his best as an active champion at 38 when he flatlined 20-0 Pulev, than he was at 41 coming off a humiliating defeat and a 17 month layoff.

This isn't about "giving credit where it's due", it's about having basic powers of reason on one hand and being stupid on the other.