Sonny Liston of the First Ali Fight vs Peak Rocky Marciano

But Liston less and not that often again.
And 5 years difference is nothing in boxing, but you want to make it look like a big difference which isn't.
And again Liston lost in his last big fight against Martin while Marciano in his last fight beat Moore.

Retired because back problems not obvious reasons.
If he retired because someone please tell me who that is?

 

Where were the alleged back problems vs Moore? That’s right, there weren’t any.

What there was, was an incredibly gruelling fight against a LH pushing 39 yo, almost 7 yrs Rocky’s senior, a fight in which Marciano was downed hard and had to fight for ALL he worth to finally overwhelm Moore.

Whats 5 years difference? You’re getting desperate aren’t you? And it’s a 5 years difference between two fighters over the age of 30, not like a difference between, say, a 22 yo and a 29 yo.

Marciano’s last fight: age 32. Liston when he fought Martin (who was no “bum” - your knowledge is poor): age 37 (though last census suggests he was that much older).

Marciano retired because he knew his time was definitely up - likely defeat loomed in the next few years. Simple logic is not your forte.

 

But they were against Cockell when Rocky said he didn't and couldn't train that much anymore.

Archie Moore was rated 3rd best LHW of all time after Ezz and Tunney wonder where is Martin ranked?
Maybe in your book is Martin better than Moore but in my isn't and in book of every boxing historian isn't too.

When someone is 32 and someone is 37 that is not big difference at all.
Holyfield fought Tyson who was that younger than him but no one brags about Holyfield age.
Difference is difference and it does not matter if you are in 20s or 30s.
Ali was how many years older than Foreman?
Yeah, that's right.

Martin was nothing but a can beater even Bonavena beat him.
And again it was proven that Marciano retired due to back problems.

 

Evander was 34 not 37 for both Tyson fights. Evander was also on the juice.

Ali was 32 to Foreman’s 24, and, your point is….??? Ali wasn’t 37. Where was Ali at, at 37 yo. Yeah, that’s right - you just bit your own a**.

And we’re talking Marciano at any rate - and he didn’t even fight to age 34 yo. You’re trying to compare two 30 plus yo guys with 5 years difference between them - an exact 32 (for Rocky, sealed with no more fights) vs 37. Obviously you can’t compare them at those respective ages.

Retired due to back issues? Another self serving leap of faith (aka invention). Point to where Rocky himself cited back issues as the reason for his retirement.

Just another pertinent question that you no doubt will be unable to answer. You’ve proved nothing.

 

Evander was also 5 years older than Tyson,Lewis,Morrison...but he gave everyone tough fight.
Hell Foreman and Holmes were top conteders being 10-15 years older than anyone.
Juice?
Everyone was on juice in 90s

Ali was 8 years older than Foreman and no one mentioned that but when Liston is older everyone brags about that showing how stupid his fans are.
Ali at 37 beat Leon Spinks and still fought eith Holmes while being punch drunk while Liston lost against no one , Leotis Martin.

Marciano retired because back problems and his manager.
But it is nice to know you are trying to prove me wrong even if you can't because there was no one whom Marciano think he would lose against him.

 

Marciano at peak would not be intimidated by Liston, and his will and endurance would bring out the dog in Liston.

Maricano by ko late.

 

Baer was opening up on Louis and had him overwhelmed at the end of round 2?

Had he not broke his hand in that flurry he would have potentially Kod louis. Baer was without his best punch ( the right hand) the rest of the fight and he became timid from pain and inability to use it.

Louis's best victory is not as great as many think it is.

 

Yes, thanks god someone realizes that.
If Baer trained his whole life,learned art of boxing and healthy hands, he would stop Louis early.

 

Hi Buddy.
On the subject of Marciano and his reasons for retiring, from all that I have read over the many years that I have followed boxing, it would appear that there was a concern ( in Rockys mind ) at least, that the current and rising crop of young HW were of course younger and in Pattersons case very nimble on their feet, and secondly his festering hatred towards Weil was overspilling into both his private life, and more importantly into his boxing career, I have not read any articles where Rocky has complained or mentioned his back, to the extent that would be a factor in whether to continue fighting or not , that's just me, if you have indeed read to the contrary , then I will take you at your word, with reference to the Martin fight, again from what I have read, Liston was ahead on points, and had put Martin on the canvass in the 4th round.
Stay safe hombre.

 

Evander was LESS than 4 years older than Tyson.

It doesn’t matter who else might’ve been on the juice in the 90s, you’re comparing 34 yo Evander to 37 yo (at the least) Liston of the late 60s - Liston who was 3 years older and CLEARLY not on the juice.

And you inappropriately moved to Evander because your irrational attempt to compare a 32 yo Marciano to a 37 Liston wasn’t holding up.

Of course Ali was 8 years older - but Ali was only 32, the same age that Marciano was when he has his LAST fight.

You said 5 years makes no difference - I said look at Ali, 5 years later from 32 to 37 - no difference there? lol, you ignored that because you had NO answer to it.

At 36 Ali LOST to an 8 fight pro and he still only regained the title from the same fledging pro. Again, you have nothing.

As to the ridiculous claim that Marciano retired due to back issues. That has already been proven to be false - and you were asked to provide a quote of Marciano stating he retired due to back issues - as usual, you came back empty handed repeating your hollow claim.

Read Mick Cannon’s post re the reasons behind Marciano retiring. Mike’s post is perfectly correct.

You’re simply continuing to mis-state numerous facts to suit yourself - .and you still cannot answer any of the most simple questions put to you.

 

Cleveland Williams wasn't intimidated either, and also had excellent will and endurance. See how well that turned out for him.

 

In July, after experiencing pain while playing with his three-year-old daughter, Marciano checked into a hospital and was diagnosed with a ruptured disc in his back. In October, at a press conference in Washington, when asked if he really intended to stay retired, he replied, "Sure."He was suffering from a bad back, one that made the ordeal of getting through a training camp so much harder – Marciano would put himself through incredible pain and suffering in each and every training camp he had, this before his back began playing up. His manager Al Weill was taking far too much of his purse money.

 

In July, after experiencing pain while playing with his three-year-old daughter, Marciano checked into a hospital and was diagnosed with a ruptured disc in his back. In October, at a press conference in Washington, when asked if he really intended to stay retired, he replied, "Sure."He was suffering from a bad back, one that made the ordeal of getting through a training camp so much harder – Marciano would put himself through incredible pain and suffering in each and every training camp he had, this before his back began playing up. His manager Al Weill was taking far too much of his purse money.
You should check your facts and talk less so maybe you would then sound smart ha?

 

4 and a half years which isn't that much as you want to make it.

Juice or not 3 years is not big difference.
Calm down pal it is 3 years not 30 years.
So someone eho is 3 years older than someone is so much past prime than the one who is 3 years younger?
Laughable.

 

I must admit. You’ve got me.

Got me laughing.

Marciano did not retire due to back issues.

He never included back issues as his reason for retiring. I’ve already outlined the reasons for Marciano retiring.

Marciano precluded RETURNING from retirement due to a back injury. Simples.

You should actually read and understand the FACTs properly.

The math is simple re the age diff. between Evander and Mike. How is it you keep getting it wrong - that’s right, to suit your argument.

Evander: approx. 3 years 10 months older than Mike. NOT 5 years, not 4 1/2 years. Juice does and did make a difference.

But let’s be clear: It was a 32 yo Marciano you were comparing to an offical 37 yo Liston in the first instance.

You went off from that point because you didn’t have a point. Now you’re trying to fixate on 3 years diff, (between Liston and juicy Evander) trying to avoid the original 5 years diff, (between Liston and Rocky).

Pointless meanderings and smoke screens don’t cut it.

First and foremost, WHATEVER reasons Marciano retired - you logically can’t compare
Marciano’s last fight at age 32 to Liston’s fight vs Martin when Sonny was an official 37 yo.

Again, simples. At least for most everyone else.

And, IF you wanted to falsely rest on Marciano retiring due to a pre-existing bad back - then you would be acknowledging his body breaking down at just age 32 yo.

Hope this is making sense to you? Perhaps too much sense? Preparing to switch horses yet again, maybe?

So,…based on your belief, you’re fine accepting that Rocky retired at JUST 32 yo due to a bad back but baulk at due factoring of the serious and future life impacting injuries sustained by Cleveland Williams’ via gun shot at age 31 1/2 (near Rocky’ retirement age, eh?).

Why would I not be calm? I’m not the one acting like the proverbial cat on a hot tin roof. Lol. You make this too easy.