Do you agree with Mike Casey that Tyson's stoppage of a past it Larry Holmes was not an aberration

Yeah, who in the article didn't think Lennox Lewis was a top 20 heavyweight and thought Lewis had a glass jaw?

Olympic Gold medal winner (beating future Hall of Famer Riddick Bowe in the final). Retired on top as heavyweight champion (stopped future Hall of Famer Vitali Klitschko in his last defense). And he beat everyone he faced as a pro in between.

But Lewis isn't top 20?

Boy, sometimes I forget how much people DID NOT like Lennox Lewis back then. They just had blinders on.

 

50/50 fight for me. Mike would seem to be a tough match up for prime Larry but Holmes had all sorts of hard fights and he found a way to win them whereas Tyson didn't.

 

Holmes won practically every round.

 

Lewis is top 6 ATG minimum imo. Holmes top 3. Mike makes the top 9 or 10.

 

Using that same line of reasoning, Larry beats Tyson because Holmes both went the distance and gave a more than decent fight against prime Holyfield, while Mike got the crap smacked out of him by a past it Holy.

No offense meant.

 

Berbick was the first guy to go 15 rounds with Holmes as champ. It was a big deal when Berbick went the distance.

 

No, because they actually fought and Mike Tyson knocked out Larry Holmes.

I was pointing out that when Larry Holmes was younger than he when he fought Tyson, guys who gave him trouble (or beat him) were also quickly dispatched by Tyson, like Larry was.

And I was pointing out that Larry Holmes was a sucker for a right hand, which Tyson flattened him with ... the same punch others flattened Holmes with.

That right hand by Tyson to cause the first knockdown wrecked Holmes. The fight was essentially over at that point. Larry was just in survival mode. Is Larry in any less survival mode if he got hit with that same right hand thrown by Tyson when Larry was 30? IMO, no.

 

Machen went the distance with Sonny Liston but that doesn't change the fact the fight wasn't close at all. Berbick going the distance with Holmes doesn't mean it was close, it just means he had a good chin or knew how to survive. I suggest you watch it again.

 

The right Shavers hit him with was far harder. Watch the knockdown shot, especially how Shavers followed through with it, his right leg literally stepping forward as his entire weight went into it. Holmes got up from that one and ended up smacking him all over the ring.

As fine a puncher as Mike was (and DAMN that man had some ******edly amazing speed on top of strength!) he never hit anyone that hard. Not even close.

Larry was over 18 months ring rusty against Mike, coming off two losses, 38 years old versus a guy nearly young enough to be his son, in his prime, a fellow top 10 ATG.

 

Please dont take any of this personally, my friend. I respect your views and always make sure to check out your posts.

And you did emphasize how you weren't saying Larry didn't have a chance.

 

Maybe. According to Atlas, Cus trained a teenage amateur Tyson for a potential fight with Holmes down the road. Cus felt you could time him with the right hand. Weaver hurt him with it, Snipes dropped him with it, Shavers dropped him with an overhand right, etc…..Eventually it’s how Tyson beat Holmes, though obviously a prime Holmes would be harder to time than a 88’ Holmes.

 

Yes, Berbick had plenty of heart! Check out how hard he tried to get up against Tyson, the ref had to stop it. Trevor's legs wouldn't follow his heart.

Tha Berbick-Holmes fight is what I often point to as The Masterclass of a heavyweight jab. Berbick messed with Holmes' head a few times during the fight, and that kind of knocked the latter mentally off balance. But that vicious, snapping jab...listen with the sound up to hear just how nasty that punch landed. Imagine how it felt to be on the receiving end...

 

Looking at the way Wetherspoon hurt Holmes, which by the way and all the credit to Holmes , I seriously have no idea how he made it through that round. If a young Tyson got him in that state I have no doubt he gets stopped.

I know Spoon and Tyson have very different styles and Tyson may not have ever got a prime Larry in that state, but it’s some food for thought. I’m not sure Holmes survives if he gets hurt that badly. Tyson was an excellent finisher.

 

Watch how Earnie Shavers followed up that knockdown and how Mike Tyson finished his first knockdown of Holmes.

Earnie was throwing WILD right hands a foot away from Holmes and almost falling down. Tyson just zeroed in and took him out.

That's my point.

I don't know if Holmes survives if he got hit by the same right hand when he was younger. When he got hurt earlier in his career, he wasn't fighting Mike Tyson. Tyson was a good finisher.

I can't count the number of times Shavers dropped someone only to lose.

Didn't happen too often with Tyson.

Whether Larry could get up and survive, like he couldn't do when he was older, is the key, to me.

 

When did I say Holmes-Berbick was close?

I suggest you read what I wrote again.