Holyfield or Usyk? Who is greater?

Usyk has some way to go still

 

I respect Usyk for going to fighters backyards and winning and that is commendable. But i do think people do go a bit over the top when rating Usyk, he was a Heavyweight fighting as a Cruiserweight remember he won Amateur titles as a Heavyweight. And even fought Joyce and those other WSB fights at Heavyweight.

He's not some small guy moving up to Heavyweight, he was always technically a Heavyweight in my view. Maybe not quite up to standards of the Super Heavyweights of today regarding size, but in pretty much every era he would be a perfectly sized Heavyweight.

Overall Usyk has a very fine record but i do think maybe fans have overrated him a tad, for me he still has alot more proving to do at Heavyweight atleast.

 

If Usyk beat Fury then Usyk, the fact Usyk has done it all on the road counts as a big deal for me.

He has fought in everybody's backyard, in other champions backyards, hostile environments and come away with the W.

 

Exactly even against Lewis Holyfield wasn't in his prime at 37/38, and still came close to beating him in their 2nd fight. It's not like Usyk is beating a prime Lewis at the same age or Byrd at 40 either.

 

Is greatness boxing on well into your 40's and becoming a punching bag for Byrd (self-confessed blown up SMW), Toney (former MW), Donald, Sultan and quitting against Sherman Williams? Is it going 1-1-1 with J. Ruiz, 1-1 with Moorer, 1-2 with Bowe and losing to Lewis?

Holyfield would have had a greater legacy (and substantially more braincells, so more able to enjoy life and maybe not bankrupt as well) had he retired after the Rahman fight, the 2nd Lewis fight, the 2nd Tyson fight or the 2nd Bowe fight. There's something to be said about knowing when to stop, Lewis is a good example of this. With hindsight Holyfield should have retired after Bowe 2 and only come out of retirement 3 years later for two fights against Tyson before retiring for good.

He could've generally been remembered as the best heavyweight of the 90's: 32-1, 1-1 with Bowe, 3x heavyweight champion, 2 KD's received, 0 KO defeats, wins over Foreman, Holmes, Bowe and Tyson x2, rather than 44-10-2-1 NC with 6 KD's received and 2 KO defeats.

Usyk is definitely the more accomplished amateur, the more accomplished cruiserweight and the P4P No.1 (Holyfield's highest ever ranking was No.3). Holyfield has many more heavyweight wins but 10 losses (5 in his 30's) to Usyk's 0 (despite fighting in the backyards of every contender and champion) and Usyk is 2-0 against A-side SHW KO artist Joshua, who is one of the six most accomplished heavyweights of the last 20 years. Prior to Usyk, no ex-cruiser had ever conclusively beaten a heavyweight as big, dangerous and accomplished as Joshua, let alone in his backyard, let alone twice, let alone as the clear B-side, let alone with the pressure Usyk had on him in the rematch due to the Russo-Ukrainian war.

 

Holyfield for sure.
His 15 rounder vs Dwight Braxton was far more demanding and significant than Usyk beating the likes of Mario Breidis Hollywood Tony Bellew, or Marco Huck.

Usyk would have to fight at least a decade at HW to even scratch what Holyfield accomplished there.

A better comparison might Usyk to Michael Moore or Michael Spinx

 

The bar is set low for some of the fan favorites in the forum. The question is ridiculous in itself. Those 90's heavyweights FOUGHT. They went to war in the ring and Holyfield was elite in those years.

 

- Minimal amateur record, took up boxing at 23 while behind bars, turned pro at 25 immediately post-prison, 10 years boxing experience

- 5'5.5, 190 lbs with same day weigh-ins, former LHW who had competed sub-170 lbs as a pro, 52% KO ratio prior to Holyfield 1

- Little southpaw experience (1/29 of his opponents pre-Holyfield is listed as a southpaw)

- 2-1 (all by MD/SD) against one-time LHW title challenger Johnny Davis (3-0, 10-2, 15-4, 5 KO’s in 26 fights)

- Lost 9-5-1/10-5 to 173 lbs M. Spinks 3 years prior, 10 months removed from losing to 197 lbs Ocasio (20-4-1, 2-9 post-Qawi)

 

Qawi losing by 3 or 4 rounds against arguably a top 5 Light Heavyweight of all time "Michael Spinks" in a competitive tough fight, is certainly not disgraceful is it ? Considering Spinks is probably one of the best H2H fighters ever in Light Heavyweight history.

And Ocasio vs Qawi is widely considered a robbery. And if you'd actually watched the fight instead of searching up on boxrec you'd know that.

 

A cheat? When did he get caught cheating?

 

Lol! Usyk on the same PED regimen as Holyfield was on would DEFINITELY be able to beat the same guys you mentioned at the same ages Holyfield did No question. And Usyk would probably be more than willing to do so right in their hometowns.

Usyk>>> Holyfield

 

Holyfield at this stage in Usyk' career. Holyfield was the Undisputed champion at both Cruiserweight and Heavyweight. I love Usyk but he still has alot of work to do before he can be placed above Holyfield.

 

I didn't say it was "disgraceful" for Qawi to lose clearly to 173 lbs Spinks.

I was not interested in revisionism, I was posting some facts about his career.

I did however neglect to mention a couple of other important facts:

- Little southpaw experience (1/29 of his opponents pre-Holyfield is listed as a southpaw)

- 2-1 (all by MD/SD) against one-time LHW title challenger Johnny Davis (3-0, 10-2, 15-4, 5 KO’s in 26 fights)

 

Jesus, how many times do we have to say the obvious?

Evan Fields did it with PEDs. It taints his entire legacy.

Usyk. Period.