1982: Bobby Czyz versus Tony El Torito Ayala

Ayala had potential but the truth is Moore was actually way more proven than him with multiple wins over contenders and he won a strap. Ayala was still at the stage where he could have been a bust. I'd not count out Moore against him as Moore had a huge heart and showed he could take it as well as dish it out. Ayala had not yet proven this. I'd also take the Duran that beat Moore to beat Ayala down as well.

 

You make many good points and I agree with most of that.

Hearns/Ayala would have been a toss up, given Tommy's chin. On the other hand, he could pulvarize Ayala quickly from long range if he gets there first.
Duran I think would have gotten his fighting spirit up for this with the whole macho latin thing. I can see Ayala getting under his skin and Duran coming in at his best for that. Roberto had more all-around ability, and slugging in close with a guy his own size was his game that he did even better than Tony.
I don't see TA beating Leonard or Hagler either. No way he would outslug Marvin, I agree with you.
Benitez I think would have been winnable because WB was starting to lose it then. Even Moore stopped him in 1984, very quickly. Yes, he had head movement and could be slippery, but I'm not sure he would beat Ayala. Yes, he beat Duran, but Duran was in an and outer at that point in his career. Fat and lazy one second, but then could give Hagler a tough fight.

We'll never know for sure about Tony Ayala because he was a drug user who loved to drink and had other serious issues that sent him to prison. Regardless of how he would have done, I think he wins a belt back then, and even if he didn't beat any of the "big four", he would have gotten those fights and would have made a lot of money. He threw his opportunities all away.

 

I agree that Duran would have been too much too soon for Ayala. Duran would have gotten up for that one and yes, I would have favored Duran in that. Inside fighting was his thing and he could do that even better than Tony.

 

I think Hearns would absolutely wipe the floor with him, personally.

As you say tho we are a little short of proof either way. I'm of the opinion he would have went bust particularly given the timelines dictates if he beat Moore he almost certainly fights Duran. We'll never know of course.

 

Bobby would have been in nappies in ‘82, how old was he then?

 

Wow, from Jersey, deep.

 

I understand your view, like you said everyone is entitled to their opinion. I just can't see Tony doing the trick unless he THUMBED Davey (hint).

 

Got any good gym stories from that Duva stable in that time frame that you can share?

 

I honestly can't see Ayala lasting more than a couple rounds against Hearns. He's tailor-made for Hearns...a short guy with no reach and subpar defense who leads with his face. Never mind Hearns' chin...people thought Cuevas would KO him too. Ayala would be the same deal...Hearns not having to deal with chin issue because he'd obliterate him so fast.

 

Yea, I agree. Everyone's issue with beating Hearns was getting inside which wasn't always easy. I think if Ayala could get close he could make something happen, but I would not bet on it either. Hearns would probably strike first from long range and if he did, the fight would be over fast.

 

I'm Ayala's comeback he quit against Yori Boy when he couldn't impose his will. That's all I needed to see regarding Ayala. Czyz was a good fighter. Solid. I'm taking Czyz.

 

I was only 10 at the time and this was right after Ayala went to prison, so I never met him.

Stories: Nothing really earth shattering. Just a good time in my life. It was a nice clean gym. Czyz was always there. I remember him hitting the heavy bag and knocking it up in the air like it was nothing. Everything impressed me at that age. He always had a brace of some kind on his arm when hitting the heavy bag, he must have injured it. He was real quiet and never said anything. Had a babe of a girlfriend that used to come watch him train sometimes...

I remember Bramble there hitting the heavy bag and thought he punched like hell. Wore old beatup green trunks that looked like they had stains from every sparring session he was ever in lol. He was just a regular guy. I don't remember him there that often...

Never met Rocky Lockridge or Johnny Bumphus, but got signed pics of them from my trainer (Art Cavaliere). Lockridge was going to William Paterson College at the time. Too bad how he ended up...

The gym was run by all old-timers. Ace Marotta, Art, his brother Paul Cavaliere (pro heavy who was Joe Louis' sparring partner and was supposedly fired for making Louis look bad). Their nephew Joe Cavaliere.
No games in this gym. It was old-school. This was not the Mayweather gym with his posse of hangers-on laughing, talking trash, and swearing all about. The only thing you heard was the sound of fighters working out, and the music coming over the stereo.

Duva would be in and out, and the only person he ever spoke to was Bobby Czyz...

Hope you enjoyed, thanks for asking...

 

No problem, fair enough.

 

I agree. The Hamsho fight makes me give Ayala the edge. Though Czyz is the larger man, I give Ayala the edge due to sheer meaness.

I'll add though Ayala punted vs Yori Boy, it was in his second career, after prison. Ayala was likely about 75% of the fighter he was before prison.