Hagler vs GGG skillset

Thanks Cyril. My list is

1. Monzon
2. Greb
3. Hagler
4. SRR
5. Hopkins
6. M Gibbons
7. Ketchel
8. Steele
9. Ryan
10. Burley
11. Williams
12. Apostoli
13. GGG
14. Fitzsimmons
15. Walmer
16. LaMotta
17. Yarosz
18. Dillon
19. Flowers
20. Tiger

 

Good question. Both had grade A chin, so hard to choose there. They both also had great gas tanks, but Hagler tired a bit against Vito while GGG always ended strong, even when he lost, so a small edge to him there.

I'd also say that he was a bit stronger, while Hagler had the better mobility and speed of hand and foot.

Mentally, Hagler seemed a bit uncertain against both Duran and Leonard, while GGG only looked uncertain in his last fight with Canelo, but at that point he must have known that his body just wasn't up to the task anymore.

 

MY MIDDLE WEIGHT LIST

1. Carlos Monzon
2. Harry Greb
3. Sugar Ray Robinson
4. Marvin Hagler
5. Bob Fitzsimmons
6. Dick Tiger
7. Bernard Hopkins
8. Charlie Burley
9. Tommy Gibbons
10. Jake LaMotta
11. Marcel Cerdan
12. Gennady Golovkin
13. Emile Griffith
14. (Nonpareil) Jack Dempsey
15. Stanley Ketchel


I think you slightly underate Greb there, Cyril, and very, very slightly overrate GGG.

Grab usually ranks top or second on the Middleweight lists I have seen, and GGG doesn't often make top ten in such a deep division.
It's unfortunate we don't have any film evidence. I usually weigh resume twice as highly as the 'eye-test.'
And no video makes the eye-test impossible.

There was a rumour once on this forum that a certain poster (who will remain unnamed) had Greb video that he declined to share, but I never believed the story.

 

Decent list, Greg.

My main quarrel would be your number 4, SRL.

He has one notable win at MW and it was quite controversial.

Is it possible you meant to type SRR ?

 

Exactly that Cuchulain, thank you for noticing and pointing out, much appreciated.

 

D

Don't reckon you even read my post pal.

 

Hagler spoke about retirement long before the Leonard fight. He even told Leonard he was thinking of quitting because he found it more and more diffucult to get motivated. Obviously this is one of the reasons Leonard ended up challenging him when he did.

 

In terms of skillset, Hagler did just about everything better than Golovkin.

 

They were at lunch together at SRL new restaurant in Baltimore, where Leonard invited him ... He did tell him that. What's even more interesting is that he also told him that he was slowing and was starting to cut more... which is exactly why SRL fight plan was to slug it out with Hagler and stop him on cuts ... Until Ray got knocked out in sparring by Taylor. Thus, needless to say Ray and team changed plan just 5 days before the fight .. We better outbox him

Fun little back story there that you mentioned

 

Just for clarity Leonard didn't actually leave his feet tho he later said Taylor almost knocked him out. In later telling Leonard termed it as knocked out but said he was out cold but played it off so no-one would know which is a long way from being out cold, really. At any rate it appears he was out on his feet for a split second and as you say it changed up his strategy significantly if we are to believe him.

 

I didn't like Ray Leonard at all. But I will say this about him now and over the many years as of late, I have actually learned to like him and respect him so much more now because I believe he learned about humility. The best example that comes to mind is that he really goes out of his way EVERY interview to give Hearns the credit he deserves for winning their 2nd fight.. I think he has an appreciation for Hearns, Duran, and Marv.. because they were all able to continue to fight and have very active careers while he was not ... And I really have no reason not to believe Ray what he says about the Hagler fight because Ray and Mike were always looking for an angle and the Hagler fight wasn't any different imo , as he clearly explains in his interviews

 

Good stuff surf. He obviously saw himself as the smaller man (and huge break etc) with all the disadvantages and has no bones about trying to even the playing field a bit, in his own eyes.

Great great fighter.

 

No, Hagler had a chip on his shoulder and wanted to be great. If he was hurt in a fight he would never admit it.

 

Niether need except losses they felt were robberies. The writing was on the wall from the very beginning with Canelo. Canelo did his part by keeping the fights competitive, the judges took care of the rest. No need for Golovkin to kiss his a**! They did Golovkin wrong.