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The Thriller In The Manilla it felt like a perfect ending to their respected careers.

 

Yep ideal time.

 

I don't see how the Manila fight was the "ideal" time.

The Fight of the Century would've been the ideal time.

They were both undefeated going in. It was at the Mecca of Boxing, Madison Square Garden. It was a bigger fight than both their second and third meetings. They were the two top fighters in the sport, without question.

Retiring after that would've prevented Frazier from getting humiliated by Foreman. It would've prevented Ali from getting his jaw broken and struggling with Norton. They would've saved both countless beatings. Frazier wasn't as good again after that. Ali would've been viewed as a serious political person, not a guy who sparred celebrities and a guest starred on variety shows telling bad jokes.

That would've been ideal.

But fans don't really want "ideal." They don't want boxers to retire on top. They want them to lose to the next top fighter. If they leave before that happens, people feel they were cheated.

 

I'll say in 77 after the Shavers win and the Foreman loss. I think Joe was always gonna want another crack at Foreman and it would save Ali the punishment of the Berbick and Holmes losses.

 

Ali fought Berbick in the Bahamas like a week or so after Joe fought Jumbo Cummings.

They could have combined the event as Ali-Frazier IV: Two Geezers in their Pajamas in the Bahamas … and then retired after.

 

If they retired in the same year…as they actually did as two past it old fogeys in ‘81 as Pat said above…1974 would be as near as ideal as possible IMO.
If they retired after FOTC for instance, which would have meant that both avoided defeats/further defeats, then Ali would never get the chance to avenge the Frazier loss…that would not suit him in any way. I can see how that would suit Joe though as his legacy would be sky high. A victory over the legendary Ali and a blemish free unbeaten record as well. He’d be a top 3 ATG HW shoe-in without a doubt, especially with no Foreman KO defeat to spoil his record.

However…retiring in 1974, Ali would have avenged his defeats against Frazier and Norton by then, and then retired after beating Foreman for the title. Yes Frazier would have the brutal loss to Foreman on his resume, but he’d avoid yet another KO loss at big George’s hands. And at least he’d be 1-1 with Ali, not 1-2. Plus he would have also have had the minor kudos of signing off with a victory. Which was a TKO win against the talented Jerry Quarry.

They can then both go home and sleep well with only two defeats apiece, 3 world titles between them and both level pegging against eachother.
Win/Win-ish.

 

Sounds good to me.

 

All fair points.

From a purely health perspective, obviously the earlier the retirement the better.

From an all time standing perspective, had both retired immediately post the FOTC, I suspect Frazier would be ranked higher, whilst Ali would cede his position as the consensus (or close to) GOAT HW to Joe Louis.

 

No thread is ever simple with you!

I guess the Thrilla in Manilla woudl be the sweet spot.

Nothing that happens to Frazier after that enhances his legacy in any way.

Ali looses a few decent scalps, but perhaps keeps his health.

 

Right after Thrilla in Manilla. They both like the ladies, could have gone chasing women together in Manila.

 

And they would have probably been just as competitive in that field as they were in boxing. "This may shock and amaze ya but I'm gonna pull more women than Joe Frazier"

 

So what if Muhammad Ali, and Leon Spinks had to retire at the same time?

Is there perhaps a sweet spot there?

 

so Manila, but unlimited rounds/death match