Why is Roy Harris poo pooed by the malcontents of boxingforum24?

I thought he was a good contender. Not elite but a good fighter for sure. Started off his career with a good record. Got a few good wins. Fought for the title. Retired at a young age and had a successful career as an attorney.

 

Roy Cut N Shoot Harris was ranked, a school teacher who was undefeated but not a serous challenger. On the night of August 18 1958 in Los Angeles, he dropped defending champion Floyd Patterson like Rademacher before him did, but was later dispatched by Patterson. Two years later Harris was knocked out by Sonny Liston in round 1.

 

I know almost nothing about Roy Harris, but a quick look at his record shows he never won a fight outside of Texas. I would guess the "names" that were brought to Texas to fight him while building his record were past their due date and/or took the fight on short notice. Being the A side has huge advantages and if the fighter happened to have a college education in the 50s-60s it probably made his big fights an "attraction."

He was knocked out by 3 of the 4 fighters he fought outside of Texas and lost to the other one, and he was knocked out by one in Texas. I know almost nothing about him, but looking at the record makes me think it was built by some promotion to get a title fight and then his "record" was "cashed in" afterward by the same promotion. He was probably never a top fighter.

EDIT: See Dave Zyglewicz and Terry Daniels for guys who had their records built in Texas in the 60s-70s. Both got title fights.

 

If there’s one thing there’s no shortage of on this forum, it’s poo poo.

 

Thats interesting. Clever guy then. I know he came to the UK and was outpointed by Henry Cooper.

True. He wasn't good enough for Patterson and Patterson got denigrated for defending against him, London, Rademacher etc. When better fighters like Machen, Folley, Williams and particularly Liston was around. He was the daddy of them all until.......

 

Some are full of it buddy. In need of an enema. Ouch !

 

According to Choklab, Williams wasn't. Eddie Machen was undefeated until he met Ingo's Bingo on Sept 14 1958, and I believe Zora Folley had some early losses. But all were much better than Harris.

 

I know it won't be popular here, but IMO Ring magazine ratings mean little/nothing (bird cage liner), and Patterson was a good fighter who did what he could with what he had. Patterson being knocked down by Roy Harris doesn't surprise me, but I doubt Roy Harris was ever one of the best 10 heavyweights in the world. In his fight with Liston he fought squared, his elbows were out like wings, he looked like a fighter who was not well trained.

If I had a fighter in 1969-70 who was undefeated or doing well and I was offered a fight by a promoter with one caveat - that the fighter I picked would have good training for 3 weeks and be aware that he was fighting my fighter, and the options for the fight were Roy Williams, Jeff Merritt, Larry Middleton, and Floyd Patterson, with no hesitation I'd pick Patterson. For one thing, I know what I'm getting with Patterson, he's not going to get better with 3 weeks of training, the other 3 are already tough, if they had a good training camp for once and could concentrate on conditioning and one fighter they might be monsters. I suspect that Patterson would not have taken fights with the other 3 either.

Just my opinion, just because someone is ranked by The Ring (or any other boxing mag or boxing commentator) doesn't mean they are one of the best in the world. Watching them fight, knowing who they fought, and talking to their opponents would mean much more. I would not rate a fighter on the opinion of Nat Fleischer, Loubet, Bert Sugar, Randy Gordon, Jim Lampley, Larry Merchant, etc.

 

Roy Harris was undefeated in 23 bouts before facing Patterson on August 18 1958, he had wins over Bob Baker, Willie Besmanoff and Willie Pastrano.

 

Good points but to answer I had to look at the records of Harris, Machen and Folley. Id say in those 2 years their records were about the same. Both Machen and Folley had beat Nino Valdes, the scourge of British heavies. But then I had the advantage while very young of seeing on TV both of them, not so much Harris. Both Machen and Folley were master boxers with a punch, like slightly bigger versions of Harold Johnson. Too good for our lads in the uK. Having said that I might be underrating Harris.
Other side of the coin Id say after hearing Harris was an attorney later on that both black guys were hungrier fighters.I believe Folley went pro after fighting in the Korean War, and Machen had a spell in jail.

 

Having said all ive said, and respecting other opinions, id definitely go with that.