Boxing masterclass? - Sugar Ray Leonard

I’m not trying to put words in your mouth.

I read you as stating that Ray didn’t have any better strategic options available to him - that Duran basically forced Ray to fight Roberto’s fight - implying that Ray fought the best fight he could fight relative to the opponent before him.

My point main point was - if one can allow for Duran to have fought below his best in the rematch, one can also appreciate that Leonard didn’t fight his best fight in the first instance - electing to fight Mano O Mano, in deference to Duran’s strengths and not his own.

 

Or you can flip that on its head: if Duran forced the terms of the first fight, Leonard did likewise in the second — hence Duran fought the best fight he could in the rematch (until he quit).

 

Good trivia there, the Duran fanboys wont like that. They’ve spent the last 40 odd years saying how unfair it was to have rematch ‘five’ months later.

 

I understand (and respect) the point you are making but I don't see the equivalence in it. There is no real comparison. They are two fights with two completely different scenarios.

The explanation for the first fight is a partial truth as well. I explained why in my previous posts.

 

Sure, I understand and respect your points also.

I do see equivalence. How a fighter performs should be reasonably measured relative to the quality of the opponent they’re engaging - and, imo, that treatment should be applied evenly to both fights 1 and 2.

I think we just disagree on points that are arguable from either end.

I think it might be fair to say that I think Ray’s errant strategy in fight 1 had a more significant impact on the complexion and outcome in Montreal than what you think it did.

Therefore, in my thinking, it is more than relevant to highlight Leonard’s extreme modification in strategy for the rematch.

Highlighting same supports the argument that Ray’s strategic election in fight 1 and then subsequently modified for fight 2 made more difference than anything else - which directly challenges the degree to which Duran’s own alleged sub par condition influenced the complexion and outcome of the Montreal rematch.

Perhaps a good way to cut to the chase,- if we take what we might agree was each man’s best performance (in its own right) against the other - being A) Roberto in fight 1 and B) Ray in fight 2, I would say New Orleans Ray beats Montreal Duran by clear UD at the least.

All just imo of course and I appreciate the discussion, thanks.

 

SRL fought the first 4 rounds in Montreal almost in the same exact way he fought Benitez. SRL boxed behind the jab in a flat-footed footed manner. Duran was destroying him in those rounds.

SRL made a conscious decision to start pushing Duran back in round 5 to the final bell. SRL abandoned the jab and started having furious exchanges with Duran. SRL had way more success by being more aggressive ironically.

SRL's problem has less to do with brawling with Duran and more to do with being driven into the ropes. In the last 10 rounds of Montreal and in the rematch, SRL used two completely opposing tactics to avoid having his back touch the ropes.

I am not arguing that SRLs tactics in the rematch weren't better but why don't we actually give credit to SRL for his great performance in the first fight? He made a huge comeback, almost winning the fight by straight up brawling with Duran as opposed to his flat-footed boxing.

 

Sure, he almost won by fighting Duran’s fight in the first fight.

But fighting Duran the same way one fight’s Benitez isn’t the best possible Leonard. Ray came out and fought more flat-footed and engaged in more of a slugfest in the first fight. He utilized his boxing skills the second fight, a more cerebral performance and one more to his advantage.

Ray had his way with Duran in the second fight and made him quit.

The fact that Duran was calling Ray’s wife a ***** and challenging his manhood in the lead-up to Montreal was a psychological ploy by Duran to get Leonard to fight on Duran’s terms, to try to slug it out.

My point is that a lot of Duran supporters say ‘Ray didn’t want to beat the best possible Duran’ in the second fight. I’m saying Duran didn’t want to beat the best possible Ray — the one who could box his ears off — in the first fight.

I don’t think it takes away from either’s win. The mental game is important, some say 90 percent, of boxing. Duran won the mental game the first fight. Ray won it the second fight.

 

You have some solid points here. The rematch was basically a better SRL against a worse Duran. That's a reasonable way of looking at it. Now the question is would Duran of the rematch have a chance even against SRL of Montreal? I say a very slime chance.

 

I don't disagree. Duran's defense was better than ever in Montreal. SRL's workrate made every round after round 4 close but Duran's counterpunching was great that night.

 

I'd take second fight SRL over Duran in a bloody good fight. I think they'd both have their moments with Leonard having more.

 

I agree, it's funny how some fight fans have selective memory when it comes to their favorite fighters.
Duran gets a pass for clowning Leonard AND his WIFE prior to the Montreal fight, the insults put Leonard in such a rage he stubborly wouldn't adjust his tactics. (Don't get wrong, Duran Rightfully won that great fight, Montreal in my opinion benifited Leonard, forged the Iron in his belly, he was a great boxer, Montreal made him a great fighter, he would need that to beat Hearns. )
But Leonard got blasted by the press and fans for clowning Duran INSIDE the boxing ring in New Orleans. A belly ache? And quitting in front of millions of people? With every excuse that can be created in that situation?
A little bias in my opinion.

 

SRL was a masterclass boxer and I would say the answer is pretty simple in why in general. He had all the skill and tools you can possibly have to be the better and more effective offensive boxer, AND he knew it.. Hand speed, durability, huge power to the body, movement, stamina, heart, ring IQ always well prepared for fights and relaxed ,he had it all .. So he approached boxing as my offense is better than yours so I'm not worried at all about punches coming back.. He knew it and he had that much confidence.. and thats why he was there to be hit , but it didnt matter. Then he retired and started coming in and out of retirement and taking fights for many years.. And because of that, he lost that edge, a bit of that confidence and started worrying about those punches coming back ... But in his heyday , you would be hard pressed to find boxers who were that offensively brilliant and confident..

 

He clowned Ray in the ring in the late rounds of the first fight too — stuck out his chin tapping it with the right hand and throwing a jab. Turning his back and walking away. Gesturing wildly.

Leonard presented him with the receipts in the rematch.