Which name boosts Wilder’s ATG standing most?

You forgot the option someone he could actually beat.

 

He has beaten no one at this point. So you think Jpshua and Usyk are everyone??/

 

1. No, he doesn't.
2. Log off.

 

Wilder isn't an ATG and isn't going to go down as one, because he doesn't have the wins.

He does have ATG power and has been hellaciously fun to watch. People will miss him when he's gone and the best American HW is suddenly Jared Anderson.

 

Wrong. I'm not a big "rankings" guy and never have been. I've written a post criticising the "top 10 wins" myopia:

List the metrics in which Adamek did better against Vitali than Chisora or at least be honest enough to admit that there are none.

"And pretty much always failed when he stepped up fact, you don't get prizes for"

You give Vitali a huge amount of credit for his "unlucky" injury-quitjob to blown-up LHW/small cruiser Byrd and "unlucky" B-side cut stoppage after failing to stop a suspect-chinned Lewis over 6 rounds. Why does he get "prizes" for winning rounds but losing the fights? In fact, Chisora has three wins when he "stepped up" as the underdog (Scott, Takam, Pulev 2), Vitali has one (Hide).

 

IMO Wilder would also miss that one second in the Fury 4 fight. So Usyk would launch Wilder better, and then IMO Usyk wouldn't rise from some of the knockdowns that Fury did. But again the question is whether Usyk would be knocked down, but in 30 rounds (how many rounds did Wilder box with Fury in total) Usyk would be knocked down at least once, and once would be enough.

 

"The fact is Chisora was a fringe contender with 13 losses"

Jimmy Young had 18 losses (what a bum!), partly because he fought the best men he could, partly because he went on too long and partly because he was a consistent B-side. The same applies to Chisora.

"winning 3 rounds vs Vitali who 40+ with a bad shoulder he lost a wide decision end of."

How many rounds did TKO'd Adamek win against 40+ Vitali? How many injuries did he cause Vitali? Why does Vitali get so much credit for winning rounds and losing but Chisora not? In what ways did Adamek perform better than Chisora? You won't answer me on this because to answer it would be self-defeating.

"but he was better win than Chisora at that time end of there is no debate about it"

Peter far performed worse than the better conditioned, more skilled, more confident, more determined Chisora against Vitali and their other mutual opponents, so of course it's "debatable" as to which win is better. Wins can look better or worse in retrospect, I'm not just going by "what people thought at the time".

"The only difference between the two is that Vitali looked less beatable against B, C, class fighters."

Some other differences: Wilder is a much bigger puncher, Wilder is faster, Wilder has a longer reach, Wilder never quit on an injury, Wilder never got stopped on a cut etc.

"your the one that claims Usyk can beat the likes of Lewis, Tyson"

You're the one who doesn't know the difference between "you're" and "your".

Of course Usyk could beat them (if we had a time machine). You talk about many modern heavies being unproven against certain "styles" but how many Usyk-type opponents did they fight? Scratch that, how many southpaws? They've got zero experience against that "style", thus it's entirely reasonable to favour Usyk over them, who is clearly superior in many respects to both as well.

"Vitali has only been cut once in 47 fights that's not being susceptible to cuts is it ?"

Most of Vitali's short plodding opponents struggled to land headshots on a backfoot Vitali, though Kevin marked front foot Vitali up with his jab. You're more likely to get cut when opponents come to win and have the attributes to reach you, which Vitali's generally did not. Vitali lost once on B-side cut stoppage and once on an injury-quitjob, so of course he's more vulnerable to these means of losing than Wilder is based on the available evidence, two losses being as many losses as Lewis had in a similar number of fights to one-punch KO's from wide underdog fringe contenders.

"Vitali looked better and less beatable against B, C, class opposition which is true is it not ?"

He looked less beatable (although I don't know because he found ways to lose in ways other than getting chinned or outpointed) but also less dangerous, which is the other side of the coin that you conveniently ignore. Which is why I think Wilder would have had an excellent chance of going through Vitali's record unbeaten: he has more than enough speed and power to bomb 257 lbs Lewis out and wouldn't quit vs Byrd even if he popped his shoulder and wasn't in an insurmountable lead.

"It's widely considered in the top 10 performances ever for a Heavyweight"

Joshua made Ruiz look like a demon too but Tyson was more hyped than Joshua being a cult figure in America, hence these narratives to excuse his defeats. He was an absurdly overrated fighter in his time and still is now: 44/1 underdog Douglas, 25/1 underdog Holyfield 1, 5/2 underdog Holyfield 2, only a 7/4 underdog vs Lewis. It goes to show the level of religious faith that people had in his abilities.

"Back on the ignore list"

You'll peak again.

 

Wlad and Povektins resumes are infinitely better than Ortiz. That's the problem. To this date, Ortiz best win is Jennings from like, 2014. I have no doubt that Ortiz was a top operator but that doesn't excuse the fact that he doesn't have the resume to back up the hype he gets.

 

That's it, he's closer to being Earnie Shavers in a pitiful era of heavyweight boxing.

 

Strawman argument.

Usyk, spelled U S Y K, not USKY, was a four belt unified undefeated Cruiserweight champion who moved up and dethroned the current champion. He is in the discussion due to his total career accomplishments, not just because he beat Joshua.

AJ has lost three out of his last six. Wilder would have received credit if he managed to find his spine and fight AJ prior to this but admitted himself that he picked Fury instead so NO.

When speaking of being an all time great, as opposed to a hall of fame worthy boxer, you look at their total career.

These things shouldn't have to be explained.

 

If he manages the Usyk fight and knocks him out that’d be icing on the cake.

 

Wilder atg ?? . ATG duck maybe

 

So Usyk gets knocked down because glass jawed duck got knocked down?

 

Wilder is not and never will be an ATG in my book. The man cannot box.