Anthony Oluwafemi Olaseni Joshua vs. Robert Gabriel Helenius

You do realize a fighter can be past his prime but not ‘shot to absolute smithereens,’ right? It’s not like the moment a fighter leaves his prime he’s a complete shambles.

A fighter who is ‘shot to bits’ doesn’t become ‘unshot’ by having a training camp, lol. I’m sure he trained for Wilder too. He had something left — not that he was a world-beater, but he was capable of a good performance as shown vs. Ruiz (I remember the live thread here and some argued he was even or thereabouts going into the last couple rounds) … Wilder just smashed him because Wilder is a phenomenal puncher and that’s what happens when he lands his bombs.

Fact is, Liakhovich had never been stopped in fewer than nine rounds — the theme at the time was Wilder needed to fight someone who could take him deeper into a fight and give him rounds. In fact, he was stopped in fewer than nine rounds just ONCE in his entire career by anyone else, and that was in his final fight 7 years after Wilder. There’s a difference between a 50/50 fight and one that should offer good rounds and test the untested guy a bit by taking him into deeper waters, and that’s what this fight was on paper.

Now, go back and look at your posts on Helenius — you basically seemed hell-bent on defending this fight every time someone spat on it. People say it’s a farce and you say ‘but m’boi AJ shouldn’t have to waste a training camp’ … ummm, he can find another opponent and reschedule for a month or two down the line. The only choices aren’t ‘fight on this date or never fight again’ lol. Boxing history is full of postponements when opponents fall out, either against the same guy when it’s a training injury or finding someone else — someone worthy and interesting as an opponent — and pushing it back a bit.

Worst case, if they absolutely HAD to keep this date (they didn’t), bumping Washington to the main event is a lot better than Helenius. Or finding someone at least durable (Chisora, etc.). Instead, Eddie went straight to ‘who can we find that has a name a few people might recognized who offers the absolute most guaranteed opportunity for a quick KO.’ This fight is a sham, not ‘OK’ or ‘fine.’

 

Not to get involved in your debate, and I wasn't listening too closely to the press conference the other day ... but I thought it was weird that Dillian Whyte said you aren't paying me (to Hearn) and Hearn said he wasn't paying for anyone on the undercard, or something like that. The Saudi Prince guy was.

Hearn has also gone on record that he didn't even want Joshua to fight again until the big money Wilder fight, and that it's Joshua pushing and he wants to keep having these tuneups.

Hearn also said now that the fight isn't on PPV, Anthony Joshua is the one taking a "massive" pay cut for the Helenius bout, as opposed to what he'd have made if it was Whyte, since Joshua would've gotten most (if not all) of the PPV. (Which means Hearn isn't making as much for this fight, either.)

The fact that we got Helenius at all is great, IMO. Because when Hasim Rahman Jr. got floated as a name, it was clear Hearn didn't want Joshua fighting anyone. Helenius, despite the long odds, may surprise Joshua with the jab and cause all sorts of problems for however long this lasts.

So I wonder how much control Hearn actually has over this entire situation. If the Saudi prince told Hearn he wanted the card to go on, and the Saudi Prince is paying for the undercard, and Hearn is negotiating with the same guy for a future Wilder-Joshua fight, Hearn can't really say no to him.

And Joshua wanted to fight Saturday, too, and Hearn can't say no to him, either.

Sounds like Hearn, though he walks around like he's the boss for this event, is just along for the ride on this one and is hoping something catastrophic doesn't happen to Joshua.

Because Hearn wants the massive Joshua-Wilder payday, not whatever is happening this weekend.

Hearn even brought it up after the press conference, saying the last time Joshua had a late sub was Ruiz, and the week before that fight all people were talking about was the Wilder-Joshua fight that was supposed to take place after Joshua's New York debut.

Hearn said he was having Deja Vu. So I honestly think Eddie is sweating over this weekend. He'd have preferred to call the whole thing off.

 

Hearn & Finkel both appear to believe that Joshua is making a mistake by fighting. There's the risk of a loss plus injury, cuts and so forth. Personally I'd rather they both fight rather than sit out for well over a year (in Wilder's case) for a fight that may not even materialize.

So I credit Joshua for staying active. If he gets a much needed KO this weekend, that will put him in good shape and give him an advantage if and win the Wilder fight happens.

 

They should both fight, I agree. That Saudi offer to those four guys brought the whole division to a standstill for the better part of this year. People are just climbing out from under it.

 

14 pages of discussion... With all due respect, this fight isn't worth it. AJ puts him down in 3.

 

Fury + Saudis have ruined HW boxing in 2023. It's a shame because the current elites are all getting older and running out of time.

I'm worried about Wilder. He turns 38 in October and if the Joshua fight happens in December/January, he will be the same age as Larry Holmes when he got off the couch to fight Mike Tyson. And we know how Larry looked in that bout, even compared to Spinks. Wilder hasn't been quite *that" inactive but going 12+ months without a fight is bad news. For that matter, he has fought only one round since 10/2021.

Now, Wilder never has put on weight and looks like he's always in training, unlike Holmes. So it's not a perfect comparison. But it should be a reminder of how age + inactivity can be toxic and cause a guy to become shot from one fight to the next.

 

Right. Wilder is nearing or at the end of his career.

The fact that he doesn't get fat at all between fights and lives a pretty clean life won't age him like it did others who had to drop a lot of weight as they got older.

It also helps that he's not a short slugger, so he doesn't take a lot of punches in fights.

Also, a heavyweight's punch is the last to go, and he can still crack.

But 38 is 38.

I'd like to see him fight Joshua and Usyk before calling it a career. But I fear Joshua AND Usyk will both lose before then.

This could be a big banana peel this weekend.

Who knows, maybe Helenius stops Joshua early, Dubois gets hurt, and Usyk defends his title in two weeks against HELENIUS!!! What a month that would be.

Can't imagine the odds on something like that.

Anyway, as always, I just hope the fights are entertaining Saturday. They should be fun.

 

Right. Joshua wasn't going to fight Hrgovic on one week's notice; he has a right to train for an opponent of that caliber.

The A-side always is subject to absurd offers that no one in his position would accept. And the guys making the offers try to make the A-side look bad, but of course if the roles were reversed they wouldn't do it, either. The A-side is the one with the most to lose.

This week with Joshua has reminded me of the preposterous offers guys would make to fight ODLH, then call him a ***** when he wouldn't accept. Like Winky Wright at 160 offering to drain himself to fight ODLH at 147. Okay, man. ... Everybody wants a payday.

 

So wilder will be inactive till dis day ?

If AJ vs Wilder is happening in January, when is Wilder going to fight ?