David Haye (2009) Vs Anthony Joshua (2019 unbeaten) who wins??

He should have fought him then and become undisputed champion. Beating Cunningham, convincingly or otherwise, would have been his best cruiser win by a margin, ahead of his wars with Mormeck and Fragomeni.

 

I agree the Fury fight would have been very difficult for him back then no doubt about it mainly due to the size difference and Fury has since shown he’s the main man in the division.

I’ve never known a boxer personally who has had such bad injuries, but I still thought he would smash that cretin Bellew in the first one haha. I was pleased he got his respect from the public for bravery there.

 

"so I am a bit biased"

"Steve Cunningham won the vacant IBF against nobody"

There's a bit of bias and there's inventing facts. Cunningham won it by beating IBF champion Wlodarczyk in Poland (The IBF had been stripped from Bell for avoiding Cunningham with an alleged injury). Wlod and Cunningham were cruiser titlists before Haye. Cunningham defended it against Huck in Germany, who he stopped. He'd previously beaten G. Jones, who KO'd Braithwaite in 4 (who Mormeck and Enzo decisioned over 12) and drew with Nelson in Britain. Those are better opponents beaten than Mormeck, Fragomeni and whoever.

No.1 contender Cunningham held the only other belt and was calling Haye out to fight, even in Britain. But Haye ran up to heavyweight to fight weaker opponents for the next three years rather than follow his hero Holyfield's footsteps and become undisputed cruiser champ before moving up.

He knew Cunningham was a more skilful boxer, tough, brave, experienced, with a better engine, a 4 inch reach advantage and a style that didn't suit his counterpunching. And the consensus was that Haye would win anyway, so why risk it?

Although plenty thought Cunningham would win on these forums at the time:

https://www.boxingforum24.com/threads/david-haye-vs-steve-cunningham.46427/

 

The Ruiz win wasn't great but Haye still KO'd him, which no one had done since Tua caught a green Ruiz cold. The Valuev win wasn't great; Chagaev did much the same but still a solid win. And losing 10-2 to Wlad with a survival-first strategy wasn't great either, Ibragimov had done that.

So all that really leaves is stopping Chisora in 5, which has been the gift that keeps on giving for Haye. But one swallow doesn't make a summer, especially when that swallow is a 2x title challenger with 13 losses.

 

your right in your posts you cant disagree with any of that but ruiz was old and past it thats a fact he was rubbish he hadnt beat anybody decent since a past it golota about 5 or 6 year prior these are also facts mate also valuev lost to holyfield before he lost to haye he was beat more convincing fashion by holyfield he wasnt given decision though holyfield was robbed he was about 46 year old

 

yeah that vegan diet done a number on Haye he fell off a cliff after the diet switch was never the same again with incomplete
Protein.

 

Even the Golota win was considered a robbery. But Haye deserves a smidgen of credit for getting Ruiz out of there purely because no one had done so since he was green. Valuev and McCline (who Ruiz beat, and far easier than Peter the fight prior) could have stopped or even dropped Ruiz within about 2 years of Haye doing so but they didn't. Who knows if the Valuev-Holyfield fight was even above board, Holyfield had been going 1-1-1 with Ruiz at 37-39.

 

you are scraping at bottom of barrel valuev was crap and mccline crap also and also old

 

I don't find epithets like "crap" very useful in evaluating the levels of boxers. By this logic there are a few good or average heavies in the world and everyone else is crap or worse. We wouldn't apply this thinking to chess or any other profession that wasn't a combat sport.

But I do think Haye's record is thin relative to the hype as Chagaev and Ibragimov equalled his performances against Valuev and Wlad and the Chisora win was his only genuinely impressive performance at heavyweight (he also blasted out some weak chinned cruisers in impressive fashion). But even the Chisora win was arguably a British stoppage and Haye was being made to work hard.

 

im saying it how it is bud they were crap you can try to make it sound all good but they were rubbish jameel mccline lol he only got fights cos he was a big fella who looked like a pit bull thats it he had no skill valuev was nothing but huge giant old slow already beat by old Holyfield what way do you want it to be evaluated they were useless

 

McCline had "no skill" but he schooled Briggs and stopped Grant in 43 seconds, schooled Whitaker and stopped Boswell, gave Byrd a very close fight.

The 2nd tier of the division is "crap" by this "logic". Which means that every so often, elite fighters get beaten by crap fighters. Which means that even crap fighters can be dangerous for elite fighters.

 

AJ for me.

I really liked Haye as a cruiser. Even liked him as a heavy. Serious power.

The problem is he was a different fighter when he was concerned with what was coming back at him.

If he lands he sleeps him, but probably lean towards AJ landing enough to keep him gunshy

 

is that meant to be impressive beating briggs lol grant broke his ankle he was hype job rubbish whittackher lol you are taking the **** now Boswell I mean this is a joke mate you are just going down wikipedia or whatever n picking out names you think make your argument good you talk some shite mate

 

Look at the raft of 2nd tier/"crap" fighters (or worse) that Rahman and McCall lost to, yet they shattered Lewis's chin. Ditto Puritty, Sanders and Brewster for Wlad. If those fighters are crap, then logically crap fighters can be dangerous for elite fighters. Vitali only beat "crap" and lost whenever he didn't, which probably makes him quite crap.

 

Vitali never lost properly he lost due to technical rules he chucked it in against Byrd he could of won easy but he wanted to protect shoulder it was more important to him than Byrd win which would be nothing to him as Byrd was crap lewis tore his eye with the glove in a punch missed target doctor stopped it he was up on both on the cards you hate Vitali as he is better then your hero fury