Ranking the Hardest Puncher in Boxing History (My Opinion & Tell Yours Also)

9 times out of ten, Nat went with the old timer of his day. The same can be said of any era. 80's guys would favor Mike Tyson or Larry Holmes over Tyson Fury ete. I do think prime Louis beats Marciano, but that has more to do with his other tools than raw power on Louis's part, and I think Dempsey may have a bit of a edge because of his speed. Again ALL 3 has power that can take out a bull, and I think the difference between them is minor. Shavers may be the hardest hitter of all time, but lesser hitters has put him out for the count.

 

I overwhelming agree!
Although Louis is clearly better, including against all comers, peak Marciano (which like almost all champions came after he clicnhed the title) may well beat him due to stylistic advantages.

You can also argue that Dempsey as a swarmer would have the same advantage against Louis...
But like comparing Ali vs.Frazier-& the former was past his prime when Frazier one one close fight...
I think Louis would be good enough to overcome that.

BUT I freely admit if I can argue for Rocky over Louis, anyone can choose Dempsey!
I just think not ony was Dempsey pretty slack during his reign...
But the speed would mean less than Marciano's volume & staying power!

I doubt that Fleisher EVER picked a newer fighter over a (meaningfully) older one...Unless like I said they were really different in levels of accomplishment!

 

I am not going to write Marciano off, a fight between all 3 of em could go either way in a round ribbon thing. Perhaps Marciano wins the first match but loses the 2nd ete. I know most of these dream fights are a 1-time deal, but Pep got even in the rematch vs Sandler, and Robinson turn the trick vs Fullmer ete. ANYTHING can happen in a boxing ring, perhaps Dempsey walks into a Marciano right? Or Dempsey lands a 6 punch combo after ducking a Louis jab (Like he did vs Tunney), who knows. As far as being "Champion" goes, I do hit Dempsey hard in the all time rating because he did not fight for like 4 years of his 7 year rein. He has to be dock points in that regard.

 

Walcott did fight a faded Louis while he fought a peak Marciano. Walcott was also a lot more stationary in the Rocky fight and older, for what that is worth.
I don't think it's impossible that Rocky hit harder than Louis but I never saw him replicate the insane feats of strength Louis pulled off in his peak. Lifting Galento off the floor and ragdolling Buddy Baer and Simon was insane.

 

Speed is always an important factor. Dempsey was extremely quick. He was an extremely quick, deadly combination puncher. Fleischer who watch all these fighters in their prime bouts wrote:

“You can only compare Marciano to Dempsey in terms of punching power”.

 

Speed IS important.
But while he was fast he was out speeded by Greb, Fat Willie showed him up & he was KOed cold by you must know who-all in his prime.
I think he was quick, not extremely quick. If he was he would not have Greb, not dramatically lighter than him, seem uncatchable-though granted in a longer serious sparring session or fight he was likely to catch up to him.

Fleisher was incredibly biased.
He always liked the older fighters he knew or saw when young.
Both Dempsey & Marciano hit very hard, but some guys in both of their eras hit harder-they were just better overall.
Both Dempsey & Ali had signature huge performances showcasing dazzling abilities.
But Dempsey seemed winded quickly, more importantly both Williams & Willard were WAY past prime.
One literally shot; Willard inactive for years & soft.

Difference is Ali beat great & modern sized HWs in two decades.
I am not even sure prime Dempsey beats rehydrated LHW sized Tunney (although due to a stylistic advantage, I pick Dempsey, even though except for a few seconds Tunney absolutely dominated a still young & uninjured Dempsey in two fights.

Not saying Dempsey was trash; just accomplished less than say Marciano.

 

Dempsey speed is woefully underrated. Arcel when asked what it was like to watch Dempsey fight exclaimed “The Speed!” Prime Dempsey was an extremely quick fighter of both hands and feet.

How Greb did vs Dempsey in a sparring session with sparring gloves is absolutely meaningless. Greb did not feel Dempseys power full bore as these were sparring sessions with sparring gloves. Hearns jolted Ali with a right hand in sparring. Meaningfull? In a real fight there is no chance any middleweight beats the heavyweight champion of the world. Think Ali vs Monzon. Michael Spinks vs Hagler. Louis vs SRR.

This was actually written about in Dempseys time. Right after Grebs last meaningful heavyweight bout vs Gibbons in early 1922. Although he won he did not show what he needed to show to make people think he had a chance vs Dempsey. “anyone thinking Greb has any chance vs the champion is the next thing to being ridiculous”. Also a nationwide newspaper poll results just prior to the Greb Gibbons fight asked who should Dempsey fight next? Grebs name was not mentioned. So right on the verge of Grebs final foray as a heavyweight he had yet to capture the public’s interest. At least to any great extent. As to be expected if you think about it.

Over four rounds Meehan beat other excellent fighters as well. Longer fight probably a different story.

 

Thanks, I partially agree with you!
I used the sparring example to show the discrepancy in speed. If Dempsey was quite as quick as you say, he would have not had rings boxed around him-when only 22 lbs. separated them in their primes.
Again Dempsey was fast. I just do not believe quite as fast as you think.

But I already just said Dempsey likely catches up w/him in a longer fight.
Although Greb did *better* vs. common opponents, & was a worthy opponent.
Your comparisons to decent sized HWs vs. MW are not very suitable-since the weight & lean body mass differences are so big.

EXCEPT for Hagler vs. Michael Spinks: IF you specify peak LHW Spinks.
But Greb was no less than @ 165 lbs., Dempsey at his recognized very best 187 lbs.-almost exactly like Marciano.
Which is why I would favor Dempsey, but given Greb's superb success & how small HWs like Ruby Red-who could weight even less-would be matched against much bigger guys like Jeffries who was in the 220's...

Given how well Greb did against guys who fought Dempsey, AND how rarely he fought...
Of course he should have faced Greb!

Although again, understand I believe that unless it was the likes of a 1/2 length fight...
Dempsey would likely win.

EDIT: Greb would at least have a better chance before his severe eye injury.
I looked up the date to confirm this: that Greb could BEAT a prime Gibbons even *after* his injury was extraordinary.
Actually ALL of his fights vs. Tunney were after his injury!
But at least he had the stylistic advantage there, classic swarmer vs. slugger match up...

So if it was before the following fight, Greb would at least have better odds:

"In 1921, during a fight with tough light heavyweight Kid Norfolk (real name William Ward), he was thumbed in the right eye, which is believed to have resulted in a retinal tear. The injury would eventually lead to permanent blindness".

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Yeah that's my order as well. Louis showed enough during their fight when he was a shell of himself for me to favor him over Marciano prime for prime.

Here's an excellent assessment of their fight, and how it translates to a prime for prime scenario

I also used to favor Louis over Dempsey but I've changed my mind on the matter. Dempsey imo was bigger, faster, more skilled, and better defensively than Marciano. I don't see any advantages for Rocky other than stamina. Dempsey is also one of four people I see as being faster than Louis (in terms of hand speed at least) which would imo cause Louis even more problems, as he won't have his ridiculous hand speed advantage like he did against literally everyone else he faced.

 

Excellent post. The sparring sessions between Greb and Dempsey have been blown to ridiculous proportions today by the likes of Kompton.

Dempsey imo was one of the fastest heavyweights I've ever seen. Only people I'd rank above him are Ali, Patterson, and Tyson.

 

I don't consider Wladimir Klitschko that hard a hitter. I'd place him near the bottom of this list.

 

Who wasn't outspeeded by Greb.
Dempsey was throwing everything he had at a giant in boiling hot conditions.
Meehan also beat Langford over 4 rounds.

 

I think he is a very hard hitter.

 

Good post except.
In a real fight there is no chance any middleweight beats the heavyweight champion of the world.

Fitzsimmons v Corbett?

 

Since when did you learn to quote people?