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Were Taylor and Prograis always overrated or have they just past their prime?

Discussion in 'World Boxing Forum' started by Chitown, Dec 10, 2023.

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Usyk is the best Active Member Full Member

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Both. They are past it now and 140 division was very poor overall so they were the best available fighters at 140 for some period

Usyk is the best, Dec 10, 2023

#31

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BoxingIQ Well-Known Member Full Member

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Serge said: ↑

Firstly, neither Teofimo and even more so Haney who is clearly a natural 147/154 pounder and the biggest weight bully in the sport no exaggeration were ever 135 pounders. They were gigantic weight bullies at that weight and looked like the living dead on the scales whilst their much smaller or way smaller opponents looked nowhere near as bad or the picture of health and identical to how they did in the ring.

A former Ring magazine journalist said they have been told by numerous reputable sources within the trade that Haney has missed weight a number of times and it has been covered up. He's taken to hiding behind shades and hoodies for the official weigh ins now even though they're private ones behind closed doors, including his 140 debut the other day, because of how skeletal he looks and I strongly suspect due to his longtime involvement with disgraced PED guru Victor Conte he might be using certain illegal substances or methods to help him get down in weight that low,

With the exception of Taylor vs Teofimo the former of whom also became a weight bully after leaving McGuigan, when Haney and Teofimo moved up to 140 they were still much bigger, bigger or at worst the same size as their opponents.

The same goes for massive weight bully Crawford who spent most of his career being the much bigger or bigger man (heavier) and literally always having the reach advantage even at his second and third weight, often, as with weight, a huge or significant one

Even in his third weight class he's at worst the same size as his opponents and is a big 147 pounder. He's complaining of difficulty making 147 now and looks drained on the scales, in his third weight class for goodness sake! Not once has have he ever looked undersized at that weight because he isn't at all and if he has given away weight once of twice it sure as hell ain't by much

Kambosos beat Teofimo, the same Kambosos who lost in everyone's eyes to Maxi Hughes and who could only scrape by a well past prime 35 y/o terribly inactive Mickey Bey who had only fought once in 3.5 years and a past prime career 126 Lee Selby on SDs. Kambosos dropped Teofimo too

Teofimo also lost to Sandor Martin in most people's eyes, including getting dropped twice

So let's not act like Teofimo is unbeaten or wouldn't have 2 losses too, even worse both of which in his backyard where everything was stacked heavily in his favour, with a home ref and three home judges.

And he was dropped three times in those fights and not by hard punchers either even though he was a lot bigger than Kambosos and probably bigger than Martin too. Do those losses undo all his achievements?

Look at how hyped to hell Spence was and how much credit Crawford gets for beating him. Why? Why? Why exactly? Spence forged an entire career beating up on career 140 pounders, featherfists, career 140 pounder featherfists and in all that time he only fought 2 career 147 pounder champions and he went life and death against both of them.

And he's fought very few legit punchers, especially ones his size whose power at 147 was actually a thing.

He'd literally never proven he could put in a dominant performance against a career 147 world champion his own size and his chin, as I told you for years, is clearly shaky. Hence why he kept getting hurt and spitting out his mouth piece by light to average punchers. I told you he would get exposed when he fought a legit puncher at 147 his size or close to it and look who was right again?

Taylor beat up two of Spence's best wins in the gym when he was a 7-0 novice in Porter and Ugas, the former of whom its no secret he beat the hell out of and the later of whom he dropped and sent to the hospital with a damaged jaw. But these are only sparring stories, right? Hmm.. funny how sparring mattered when Spence was being hyped like crazy for his sparring sessions with Broner and Floyd, eh? Those sparring stories were a huge part of the reason why he was hyped so heavily and he was ranked top #10 P4P by The Ring after being a damaged goods Brook FFS and many of his idiot fans had him ranked #1 even though he had no right ever being ranked #5.

It seems like there is a different set of rules for fighters from certain parts of the world and a completely different set for everyone else and there are many more examples of this in this very post, both above and below

Crawford is another one who has barely fought any legit punchers at all, let alone ones his size (if I'm wrong, prove me wrong? You can't because I'm right) and he has 40 freaking fights. What happened the only time he fought one his size in Egis? He got dropped and Egis is C level

I also told you that Crawford would duck Super Boots like he had leprosy after beating Spence and yet again I was right.

God forbid he should have to fight another legit puncher his size for the second time in his career or an athletic phenom who can match him him for reach for literally the first time in his career as opposed to all those C level non-athletes and leprechaun featherfists or average punchers he forged an entire career bashing up. His resume is weak as hell for a 40 fight vet supposed P4P#1 and you all know it
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I'm not going to lie I agree with pretty much so everything that you said

BoxingIQ, Dec 10, 2023

#32

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Serge Ginger Dracula Staff Member

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BoxingIQ said: ↑

I'm not going to lie I agree with pretty much so everything that you said
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Thanks

Serge, Dec 10, 2023

#33
lufcrazy requiescat in pace

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They weren't over hyped at all they were legitimate talents who lost to better fighters.

lufcrazy, Dec 10, 2023

#34

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Darni187 Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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tee_birch said: ↑

I think a bit of both. Both probably slightly past prime but the division was weak when they were top dogs
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This ... The division lacked real top fighters ...140 coming too life with Teo and Haney here now, Ryan Garcia too..

Darni187, Dec 10, 2023

#35
theanatolian Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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A little overrated, yeah. They were good but not great.

Taylor/Crawford comparison(which was made a lot both going undisputed at 140) always made me laugh, long before Crawford dismantled Spence.

theanatolian, Dec 10, 2023

#36

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Maidanas Gun Tattoo Well-Known Member Full Member

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Serge said: ↑

Firstly, neither Teofimo and even more so Haney who is clearly a natural 147/154 pounder and the biggest weight bully in the sport no exaggeration were ever 135 pounders. They were gigantic weight bullies at that weight and looked like the living dead on the scales whilst their much smaller or way smaller opponents looked nowhere near as bad or the picture of health and identical to how they did in the ring.

A former Ring magazine journalist said they have been told by numerous reputable sources within the trade that Haney has missed weight a number of times and it has been covered up. He's taken to hiding behind shades and hoodies for the official weigh ins now even though they're private ones behind closed doors, including his 140 debut the other day, because of how skeletal he looks and I strongly suspect due to his longtime involvement with disgraced PED guru Victor Conte he might be using certain illegal substances or methods to help him get down in weight that low,

With the exception of Taylor vs Teofimo the former of whom also became a weight bully after leaving McGuigan, when Haney and Teofimo moved up to 140 they were still much bigger, bigger or at worst the same size as their opponents.

The same goes for massive weight bully Crawford who spent most of his career being the much bigger or bigger man (heavier) and literally always having the reach advantage even at his second and third weight, often, as with weight, a huge or significant one

Even in his third weight class he's at worst the same size as his opponents and is a big 147 pounder. He's complaining of difficulty making 147 now and looks drained on the scales, in his third weight class for goodness sake! Not once has have he ever looked undersized at that weight because he isn't at all and if he has given away weight once of twice it sure as hell ain't by much

Kambosos beat Teofimo, the same Kambosos who lost in everyone's eyes to Maxi Hughes and who could only scrape by a well past prime 35 y/o terribly inactive Mickey Bey who had only fought once in 3.5 years and a past prime career 126 Lee Selby on SDs. Kambosos dropped Teofimo too

Teofimo also lost to Sandor Martin in most people's eyes, including getting dropped twice

So let's not act like Teofimo is unbeaten or wouldn't have 2 losses too, even worse both of which in his backyard where everything was stacked heavily in his favour, with a home ref and three home judges.

And he was dropped three times in those fights and not by hard punchers either even though he was a lot bigger than Kambosos and probably bigger than Martin too. Do those losses undo all his achievements?

Look at how hyped to hell Spence was and how much credit Crawford gets for beating him. Why? Why? Why exactly? Spence forged an entire career beating up on career 140 pounders, featherfists, career 140 pounder featherfists and in all that time he only fought 2 career 147 pounder champions and he went life and death against both of them.

And he's fought very few legit punchers, especially ones his size whose power at 147 was actually a thing.

He'd literally never proven he could put in a dominant performance against a career 147 world champion his own size and his chin, as I told you for years, is clearly shaky. Hence why he kept getting hurt and spitting out his mouth piece by light to average punchers. I told you he would get exposed when he fought a legit puncher at 147 his size or close to it and look who was right again?

Taylor beat up two of Spence's best wins in the gym when he was a 7-0 novice in Porter and Ugas, the former of whom its no secret he beat the hell out of and the later of whom he dropped and sent to the hospital with a damaged jaw. But these are only sparring stories, right? Hmm.. funny how sparring mattered when Spence was being hyped like crazy for his sparring sessions with Broner and Floyd, eh? Those sparring stories were a huge part of the reason why he was hyped so heavily and he was ranked top #10 P4P by The Ring after being a damaged goods Brook FFS and many of his idiot fans had him ranked #1 even though he had no right ever being ranked #5.

It seems like there is a different set of rules for fighters from certain parts of the world and a completely different set for everyone else and there are many more examples of this in this very post, both above and below

Crawford is another one who has barely fought any legit punchers at all, let alone ones his size (if I'm wrong, prove me wrong? You can't because I'm right) and he has 40 freaking fights. What happened the only time he fought one his size in Egis? He got dropped and Egis is C level

I also told you that Crawford would duck Super Boots like he had leprosy after beating Spence and yet again I was right.

God forbid he should have to fight another legit puncher his size for the second time in his career or an athletic phenom who can match him him for reach for literally the first time in his career as opposed to all those C level non-athletes and leprechaun featherfists or average punchers he forged an entire career bashing up. His resume is weak as hell for a 40 fight vet supposed P4P#1 and you all know it
Click to expand...

American fighters have the absolute best marketing campaigns of all time.

Maidanas Gun Tattoo, Dec 10, 2023

#37

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Maidanas Gun Tattoo Well-Known Member Full Member

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Reinhardt said: ↑

It's interesting no one, and I mean no one was calling Prograis over rated until he got completely dominated last night.
Haney is a level above him that's all
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I have on this very site.

Maidanas Gun Tattoo, Dec 10, 2023

#38
Serge Ginger Dracula Staff Member

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Maidanas Gun Tattoo said: ↑

American fighters have the absolute best marketing campaigns of all time.
Click to expand...

And the absolutely huge advantage of not only their top boys being the least likely to travel but also having a stacked deck of a home ref and three judges at home in world title fights against foreigners which as I keep saying literally never happens anywhere in the world but it's all most the norm over there. This can and often does result in Ls being transformed into Ws

And in addition to that, on the extremely rare occasions one of them does travel outside the US fans want to pin a medal of honor on them even though the officials will often be neutral or at worst be a mix of home and away

Serge, Dec 10, 2023

#39
MarkusFlorez99 Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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Maidanas Gun Tattoo said: ↑

American fighters have the absolute best marketing campaigns of all time.
Click to expand...

Stop

MarkusFlorez99, Dec 10, 2023

#40
Maidanas Gun Tattoo Well-Known Member Full Member

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Serge said: ↑

And the absolutely huge advantage of not only their top boys being the least likely to travel but also having a stacked deck of a home ref and three judges at home in world title fights against foreigners which as I keep saying literally never happens anywhere in the world but it's all most the norm over there. This can and often does result in Ls being transformed into Ws

And in addition to that, on the extremely rare occasions one of them does travel outside the US fans want to pin a medal of honor on them even though the officials will often be neutral or at worst be a mix of home and away
Click to expand...

Yea, it’s weird how excited American fans get when an American finally fights outside the states. What’s the big deal when many non Americans do it all the time? They never say.

Maidanas Gun Tattoo, Dec 10, 2023

#41

Serge likes this.

Maidanas Gun Tattoo Well-Known Member Full Member

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MarkusFlorez99 said: ↑

Stop
Click to expand...

Tank Davis doesn’t have a massive campaign behind him? Cut it out. American fighters have massive campaigns propping them up for basic stuff.

Maidanas Gun Tattoo, Dec 10, 2023

#42
Serge Ginger Dracula Staff Member

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Maidanas Gun Tattoo said: ↑

Yea, it’s weird how excited American fans get when an American finally fights outside the states. What’s the big deal when many non Americans do it all the time? They never say.
Click to expand...

Yeah, they make such a big deal out of what is standard practice for the rest of us even though the deck is never stacked against them than it is us

Serge, Dec 10, 2023

#43
MarkusFlorez99 Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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Maidanas Gun Tattoo said: ↑

Tank Davis doesn’t have a massive campaign behind him? Cut it out. American fighters have massive campaigns propping them up for basic stuff.
Click to expand...

Because it's the US Tank is a star when looking through the conventional view of fans here. He is definitely overrated, but why use this to take credit from Haney and Lopez's recent wins it's dumb

MarkusFlorez99, Dec 10, 2023

#44
Carinito Member Full Member

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Mark Anthony said: ↑

Taylor was the worst champ in recent history.
Click to expand...

No he wasn't.
Rolly Romero is the worst champ in recent history.

Carinito, Dec 10, 2023

#45

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