Josh Taylor ranked #7 at WW

Discussion in 'World Boxing Forum' started by Jacques81, Dec 11, 2023.


  1. Brighton bomber

    Brighton bomber Loyal Member Full Member

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    I was thinking Benn too, he'll go right at Taylor and isn't big at the weight, that's a fight that Taylor could definitely win and would draw interest in the UK .
     
  2. Serge

    Serge Ginger Dracula Staff Member

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    Yeah I know. I saw one of his interviews a while back and he looked terrible in it and as someone from the UK who has been around alcoholics and binge drinkers since I was a young child I'm very familiar with that drinker's face. I could be wrong but at the very least we know he likes a drink and doesn't live the life.
     
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  3. Brighton bomber

    Brighton bomber Loyal Member Full Member

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    That wouldn't surprise me if he had a drink issue, much like Scott Harrison who succumbed to drink and his own personal demons. Taylor did have that drunken incident where he racially abused a bouncer though I'm not aware of any other incidents and he wasn't violent so maybe we're just making assumptions. Harrison in comparison had a litany of drunken incidents and violent assaults leading up to his career ending. If he does have a drink problem he's hidden it well from the public and media to date.

    Maybe he's declined, he definitely looked poor in his last 2 fights but then he also faced 2 opponents who stylistically were problematic. Will be interesting to see how he does at 147. If he isn't done and is matched up cleverly he could gain some momentum again and when he does step up again and no doubt lose, he will at least get one last good payday. That has to be the strategy for the remainder of his career, throwing him in too soon with anyone good at 147 like Ennis will see him get taken apart because whether it's because he's declined or that people have figured out his style, another loss is inevitable and with him at the trail end of his career he needs to maximise his earning potential before he retires.
     
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  4. Serge

    Serge Ginger Dracula Staff Member

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    Good shout. I forgot about Harrison and it's an even more apt comparison because he's obviously Scottish too.

    Binge drinking is obviously and has long been a huge part of British culture and the Scots and Irish are even more notorious for it. Even if you're a teetotaler athlete most of your mates you grew up with will be binge drinkers so you're surrounded by it, even more so up there and if you're from a small town like Taylor is.

    He was out partying and drinking and not living the life for months after the JCR fight and when he was sidelined with injury and he looked terrible in that interview I saw. It's just something I suspect but even if he doesn't have a serious drink problem he likes a drink a little more than any serious athlete ever should.

    He's definitely declined. You just have to watch his previous fights to see that. He just doesn't look the same fighter to me at all mentally or physically and it's not just because he's facing difficult styles. There's just something majorly off with him.
     
  5. Brighton bomber

    Brighton bomber Loyal Member Full Member

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    No doubt he doesn't live the life a boxer should and probably drinks more than he should. Alcohol has no place in any athletes diet and will no doubt speed up a fighters decline and at 32 he's at that point where he could suddenly start to decline.

    I'm not sure if he's really declined at all or at least declined as much as some think, because I think even prime Taylor loses to Lopez and Catterall because of the holes in his style. I think we need to see him in with a lesser opponent with a style that suits him, who will stand in front of him and trade allowing him to fight his usual style, while not being so big they can just shrug him off when he works up close. I just hope his team are not idiots and match him up with another out boxer who counter punches and uses his aggressive style against him, because whether he is still prime or in decline I don't think he has the skills to overcome that style of boxer.
     
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  6. Serge

    Serge Ginger Dracula Staff Member

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    It's not just physical it's also mental. I've been saying for a quite a while now that I think he suffers from self-confidence issues and his tough talking mean SOB hardman routine is just his way of trying to mask that. These confidence issues manifest in his performances in the ring too. He has a tendency to tense up, not use his brain and abandon his skills when under duress and he subsequently ends up loading up on shots and it makes him more predictable, easy to read, and less effective.

    He's much better when he's loose and relaxed and actually thinking about what he's doing. The thing is he's known this for a long time but he still does it often and can't seem to stop himself from doing it.

    Shane McGuigan has implied he suffers from confidence issues too and that most people don't realize that a big part of being a trainer is helping fighters deal with these type of things and that it's important to have a good trainer you gel with who knows how to get the best out of their fighters. He said it was something he was very good at doing with Taylor.

    Don't forget he comes from a very small town and was moved extremely quickly and became an undisputed champ in just 18 fights. I think the limelight and fighting on such a huge stage of that magnitude must be a daunting experience for him. Maybe not so much on fight night but behind the scenes during the lead up to the fight.
     
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  7. Brighton bomber

    Brighton bomber Loyal Member Full Member

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    I do get that feeling from him too that the hardman act is a front to disguise something, perhaps the lack of confidence. As you say he did very quickly achieved a very high level of success and status and may suffer from imposter syndrome.

    If the problem is a lack of self belief then he's done as a fighter as the loss to Lopez and how Catterall made him look bad won't have done anything for his confidence level.

    But it's impossible to know what's really going on in his head and what you see as him tensing up may simply be because he's suddenly in with opponents who are beating him and he can't find an answer and instead of elevating his performance and grinding out a win doubles down and mentally crumbles and then ends up under performing.

    If it is mental as you suggest then I think that's an even bigger problem that his stylistic weaknesses. You can grind out a win if needed against an opponent with a problematic style but it's much harder to change a fighter who has a tendency to mentally fold when under pressure.
     
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  8. Jacques81

    Jacques81 Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Now that we've got the Freudian and Jungian angles of Taylor down, who shall his WW debut be against?? Lol

    I'd love to see him plaster Thurman haha
     
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  9. gollumsluvslave

    gollumsluvslave Boxing Addict Full Member

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    As full Scot, I can confirm this.

    Anyone who doesn't 'tak a drink!' is looked down on - it's got better recently, but still very culturally ingrained
     
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  10. Komaster

    Komaster Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    racist! :lol:

    (is scots a race? :lol:)
     
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  11. Reinhardt

    Reinhardt Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Hmm? and that might be the type of fight Thurman would take. Good call
     
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  12. northpaw

    northpaw Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    I mean, I think he beats Avanesyan and Crowley and I believe both are in the top 10. He's not beating the top 5 though, not with how he's looked in the past couple years. WW is very top heavy.
     
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  13. Perkin Warbeck

    Perkin Warbeck Boxing aficionado Full Member

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    It's that Scottish whiskey, he just can't stay away from it.
     
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  14. Jacques81

    Jacques81 Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Good stuff!!

    Balvenie... Mmmm
     
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  15. Serge

    Serge Ginger Dracula Staff Member

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    The mean SOB hardman routine is definitely his way of compensating for confidence issues IMO. Seems likes he's trying to convince himself most of all with all that bravado.

    Like I said, or if I didn't I have before in other threads, I first noticed this before in fights he won. He has a tendency to load up and become tight when tenses up and not put much thought into what he's doing but when he's more relaxed and thinks about what he's doing he's much more effective and he does have good skills when he actually uses his brain and picks his shots and counter punches.

    How many times have we heard fighters say that boxing is 90% mental? I don't believe the percentage is quite that high but if you've got confidence issues and your mental is not right it can undo all your talent and hard work in the blink of an eye.

    This is one of the reasons I think Shane McGuigan was such a good fit for him when it comes to the psychological side of the game. He did it when he was with him but Shane knew how to deal with it better than others. And I just think Shane is a great trainer and strategist too.

    I don't think he folds mentally when under pressure. He's proven many times in the past that he definitely has that dog in him but his confidence issues affect the way he fights and it's a vicious circle which prevents him from getting the best out of himself.

    That being said, I think his will might be broken now due to his confidence issues and the unofficial loss in most people's eyes to Catterall and the official one to Teo who he did fold mentally against. But it was super dumb of him to fight someone as talented as Teo in his backyard coming of a long layoff, injuries and a terrible performance in his previous fight that many felt he lost.
     
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