the what fights did you watch today\scorecard thread.

Wilfredo Gomez (c) vs Azumah Nelson, WBC Featherweight Titlte.

1. Nelson
2. Nelson
3. Even (Gomez controlled more of the frame, Nelson landed harder shots)
4. Nelson (big, hurts Gomez quite badly)
5. Gomez
6. Gomez
7. Gomez (great round, very close)
8. Nelson
9. Gomez
10. Nelson
11. Nelson wins by emphatic KO.

My card: 95-94 Nelson at time of stoppage. Two judges had Gomez ahead, and the third had the fight even.

Career defining performance by Nelson to take Gomez's title in his opponent's backyard. Although my card only has Nelson up by one I fail to see how any judge could have had Gomez ahead as the rounds I scored to Gomez generally could have swung the other way. In contrast, Nelson won his rounds far more clearly.

Excellent fight that caught fire after Nelson hurt Gomez for the first time.

 

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Round one 10-9 Spinks
Round two 10-9 Spinks
Round three..you get the drift

Good fight with Spinks dominating until he scores an emphatic tko.

 

I was there in person...my little 12 year old girl's butt had the fight 98-92 for Gomez at the time...AT THE TIME! LMAO

 

Oba Carr v David Taylor

Not that I wasn't aware how this fight was going to turn out. Like most David Taylor fights, he was going to go the distance and the star of the show would have his hand raised. Taylor was very Lobito Montoya-like. You could hit him all day, not dent him and he lacked the kind of punch that would bother the hometown fighter. He was sought after by manager and promoter alike for what he could provide. And this fight was no different. No need to run a card here. I only gave Taylor a share of the 5th and the rest to Carr for a 100-91 score for Oba (actual scores: 100-90, 99-91 and 97-93 all for Carr). I chose this fight BTW, not for competitiveness, but because I like Oba Carr fights. There was one round here worth seeing if anyone is interested. It was the 10th and they went at it good. Again, this was a highlight reel fight for Carr and a guilty pleasure of mine.

 

Basically a good workout for Spinks against an off-beat southpaw. Wassaja didn’t have the skill nor the ammunition to deal with Michael, who conceded after that he took his time because Wassaja was awkward and figured he’d let him blow a little steam (not that it amounted to anything) and settle down.

Thanks for posting, because the most interesting thing about this is that TV announcer Keith Jackson mentioned that Spinks’ promoter, Butch Lewis, had offered more than $1M for a fight with then-WBA heavyweight champ Mike Weaver. He asked Spinks about it after, and Michael talked about wanting Weaver or, if that didn’t work out, Gerry Cooney.

I think I’m going to start a thread on that, because I had no memory that he had entertained a move up to heavy this early. And kind of ironic and cool that he mentioned Gerry (conceding that he’d need to put on ‘a few pounds’ first).

 

Juan Francisco Estrada v Carlos Cuadras 2

I rewatched this great fight from 2020 as I loved it so much the first time I saw it.

There’s a great little article on Fight City about why this was the real FOTY for 2020, not Zepeda-Baranchyk, and I wholeheartedly agree with the assessment.

I scored it and did a write up of it previously in this thread, which I’ve quoted below, but just watched it for fun this time without trying to assess who was winning rounds.

Cuadras started well and scored a knockdown in the third before Estrada started to take over in the second half. Estrada eschewed his more usual counterpunching style to go into all-out warfare mode from the start and Cuadras replied in kind but both fighters were throwing top quality combinations, not just winging shots.

You could see that Estrada’s punches were having the greater impact as he wasn’t taking a backward step when he was hit whereas Cuadras was visibly reacting to the hooks and right hands that Estrada was landing.

Honestly, I can’t recommend this fight highly enough - one of the best I’ve ever seen and certainly the best one I’ve seen since some of those classic all-Mexican fights from the 2000s like Morales-Barrera and Vasquez-Marquez.

Here’s my original write up and card from a couple of years back:

 

Do we think it's legitimate to count losses as wins if we genuinely believe the decision was wrong? How do you guys approach this when doing your rankings, lists etc?

 

I'll join in the Holmes vs Cooney party. I'll supply the Pepsi & the Ring-Dings:

Round 1- close round, but Larry establishing the jab, finishes with a string right hand and takes it. 10-9 LH

Round 2- jab to body, overhand right provides the knockdown gives Holmes the round. 10-8 LH (20-17)

Round 3- Good comeback from Gerry, recovered well and lands from big lefts to head and body. 10-9. GC (29-27)

Round 4- Gerry well in the fight now through using the jab more effectively and "sheer determination" (i said that in my best Joe Bugner impression too). 10-9. GC (38-37)

Round 5- Again Gerry had some success with the jab and is the aggressor, Larry comes back in the final minute but Gerry's heavier shots give him the round and make my card even at 5. 10-9. GC (47-47)

Round 6- Larry's corner starting to feel it's too close for comfort, "finish it Big Jack", Larry back on his toes, but walks into a big right hand, good body work, it's Gerry's round...but with about 25 seconds to go Larry lands a good combo, heavy right hand, Gerry goes spaghetti legs, Larry landing big shots now and the bell comes at a good time for Gerry. 10-9. LH (57-56)

Round 7- found this one hard to score, Larry mostly in control and the momentum seems to have turned but Gerry finishes with some big shots, felt this was even, but have to give edge to Gerry for the heavier shots. 10-9. GC (66-66)

Round 8- Another hard round to score, like before, thought Gerry was edging it but Larry gets the better of a good exchange late on and lands the better shots overall, to make this an even round. But i've approached this in a way where i'm trying not to score any rounds even, so have to go for Larry's sharper work. 10-9. (76-75)

Round 9- Again, Larry's corner know this is close, "get the bum outta there" says Ray Arcel. This is the round which determines how wide your card will end up, Gerry starts well but his shot now lack zip, and it looks like Larry is taking these shots on his gloves, Gerry lands a clean left and is again the aggressor, but Larry finishes well and is landing crisp rights, but maybe Gerry's aggression takes it, but i think Larry would/could have done more if the point(s) deductions hadn't have happened, as he knew they gave him the round. 9-8 LH. (85-83).

Round 10- Great round, Gerry the busier but hard to see what is landing cleanly, Larry has a strong last minute, and is landing the cleaner blows. Another very competitive round, in which both have done some good work. The last four rounds i think are examples of where you would have to be at ringside to be able to judge properly but Larry's work is sharper. 10-9. LH (95-92).

Round 11- Another point deduction, uneventful round after a good 10th, but Larry in command now. Feel bad for Gerry, as the margin is now huge and his effort had been tremendous. 10-8. LH (105-100).

Round 12- Gerry needs all four rounds and looks spent, and he's eating too many right hooks now. 10-9. LH (115-109)
Round 13- Fight is over.

Final card- 115-109. The Divine Peanut. Great effort from both men.

 

Danny Lopez v Art Hafey

Round 1: 10-10 Even (1st minute missing)
Round 2: 10-9 Lopez
Round 3: 10-9 Lopez
Round 4: 10-9 Lopez
Round 5: 10-9 Lopez
Round 6: 10-8 Lopez (scores a knockdown)
Round 7: Referee stops contest mid-way through the round

Total through 6 completed rounds: 60-54 Lopez (actual scores not known)

Man, this fight takes me back. Never knew it was out there. This is what I loved about west coast boxing. They were never afraid to make matches with other hot prospects and everyone was rewarded for it. The fighters, the promoters and mostly the fans. I remember when I first watched this back in '76. I had already heard the result, which I was not expecting (I thought it would be a knock-down-drag-out fight, not a dominated fight) and it was as reported. Although Hafey did land some bombs on Lopez, Danny really controlled the action. Great seeing this again.

 

I can’t think of any instances where I throw out the official result as ‘unjust’ but how the fighter performs in fights figures into it.

A guy fights well but loses — say Mancini vs. Arguello — counts as a loss but also shows that Mancini even on the rise was at a level where he could compete with an absolute legend. So it doesn’t hurt his standing too much (no he’s not in my ATG rankings but just a result that popped into my head).

JC Chavez rallying to stop Meldrick Taylor in the final seconds counts absolutely as a great win for me. Some can question the stoppage but to me he achieved the goal of taking out his opponent with grit and determination to keep chopping away. Yes, it could have ended up a Taylor decision … but it didn’t.

I’m trying to think of an outright robbery — it grates me that Larry Holmes didn’t become a two-time champion when he clearly in my mind (and in that of most observers) won the rematch vs. Michael Spinks, but he doesn’t get the win. I don’t count it against him much at all as it’s post-prime and he fought well for what was left in the tank at that point (he refueled for his comeback, haha). As to Spinks, I credit him with a win but don’t think it was on the level of the first fight, which he clearly won.

So ultimately the ‘we wuz robbed’ doesn’t give fighters an asterisk for me when I rate them.

 

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Round 1 10-9 Gomez
Round 2 10-9 Gomez
Round 3 10-8 Gomez
Round 4 10-9 Gomez
Round 5 10-9 Gomez
Round 6 10-9 Gomez

Valdez doesnt come out for round 7, Gomez wins by 6th round TKO.

 

James Toney v Montell Griffin 1

An absorbing, rather than exciting fight, between a Toney coming off a first career defeat against Roy Jones against an up-and-coming contender in Griffin, who showed a lot in his first big fight.

This was a classic showing from Toney in the sense that it illustrated the best and worst of him - on the one hand, his defensive skills were on display and he pressed the action against a fellow counter puncher. On the other, his output was a little too sporadic. Nonetheless, I thought he deserved at least a share of the fight and he had Griffin in trouble, most notably in the third.

For his part, Griffin boxed well behind the jab and surprised me how he managed to smother Toney’s inside work when against the ropes.

This ended in an MD win for Griffin by 114-114 (matching my tally), plus a 115-113 (fair enough) and a bit too wide 116-112. Toney dropped from 44-0-2 pre-Jones to 44-2-2 post-Griffin.

Toney-Griffin card:

1 9-10
2 9-10 (closer)
3 10-9 (Griffin badly wobbled near end of the round)
4 9-10 (close)
5 10-9 (Griffin goes close quarters with Toney in a tactical switch up but laying on the ropes and countering is Toney’s wheelhouse and he edges the round with a few well-timed counters.)
6 10-9 (Toney landed the better shots, including a few to the body)
7 9-10 (close, tricky to score)
8 10-9 (probably Toney’s best round since the third)
9 10-9 (close but Toney landed another short right that stunned Griffin temporarily and the follow up flurry was enough for him to take the round)
10 10-9 (this is a good stretch of the fight for Toney - he has landed the sharper punches)
11 9-10 (horrible round to score - Griffin proving elusive but not doing that much, Toney missing and overreaching a bit. Maybe Griffin just on ring generalship)
12 9-10 (close again)

Toney 114-114 Griffin

 

Larry Holmes KO 13 Gerry Cooney

Okay, had to post my own card. Great effort from both men, and Cooney proved competitive. A noble effort against a great champion but Holmes just a cut above. I felt the low blow in the 9th myself, that was just horrendous. Third time seeing the fight, though I believe the first time I've ever properly scored it. Cooney gives away his ntural left-handedness, as his right hand seems more a push than a punch, bjt he scored a number of times with it, unbalancing Holmes at times. Not hurting him but making him have to reset a lot. The hooks to the body, as infrequent as they were, were great but Holmes was superb at nullifying attacks and getting tough when he needed to by slashing with his own rights, which were an even more significant weapon for him than his jab, which I don't believe I've ever said about Holmes, whose entire fighting being revolved around his jab.

1. Holmes
2. Holmes (10-8)
3. Cooney
4. Cooney
5. Even
6. Holmes
7. Holmes
8. Holmes
9. Holmes (10-8 with deduction)
10. Even
11. Holmes
12. Holmes
13. Barrage of right hands fells Cooney and Valle steps in

118-110 Holmes at the time of the stoppage.

 

Didn’t Cooney get docked 2 points for low blows in one round and another in a different round?

 

Did he? Not sure, I saw just the one in round 9 but could be mistaken.