Deontay Wilder: praise and criticism

Discussion in 'World Boxing Forum' started by Redbeard7, Dec 24, 2023.


  1. Arnie 101

    Arnie 101 Member Full Member

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    AJ lost twice to the same man in the rematch it takes nothing away from him it doesn't make him weak or fraudulent. Usyk is a world class boxer who became champion in 2 weight classes there is no shame losing to him. Lennox Lewis lost to 2 bums still considered one of the greatest. It's fickle fans like you that are destroying boxing thinking no one should lose otherwise they "bums", "frauds", "exposed" and all that garbage.

    This is why boxers don't want to fight other top 10s they bloat up they undefeated streak by beating bums and tomato cans exactly what Wilder did than you have people such as yourself impressed by such numbers even when the resume is weak, until they get beat and you turn on them. This is what kills boxing MMA fighters always fight the best and even with losses the fighters are never crapped on or diminished like boxing.
     
  2. Redbeard7

    Redbeard7 Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Write another couple of paragraphs about how losing again and again "takes nothing away from you" as a top level fighter. Try to convince yourself.
     
  3. Arnie 101

    Arnie 101 Member Full Member

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    I'm stating facts this was never a thing in the 70s, 80s, 90s and 00s this toxic mentality started with Mayweather and it set a unrealistic standard that no fighter should lose otherwise they "finished". This is why boxing is this way the best is avoiding each other to avoid the 0 that is facts.
     
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  4. BoxingIQ

    BoxingIQ Well-Known Member Full Member

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    Wilder is basically the modern day David Tua
     
  5. Redbeard7

    Redbeard7 Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Tua was a 5'9, 69 inch reach plodder. Wilder is 6'6 with an 83 inch reach and was athletic.
     
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  6. Redbeard7

    Redbeard7 Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Losing has always mattered, though Mayweather inflated the value of the 0. Everyone has always known it's bad to lose again and again as a top level boxer.
     
  7. Arnie 101

    Arnie 101 Member Full Member

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    This is literally your opinion but history shows another story because there are boxers like Muhammad Ali, Joe Louis, Jack Dempsey, Joe Fraizer, George Foreman, Lennox Lewis, Mike Tyson that have Ls and alot of them are considered bigger legends than Rocky Marciano this is not an opinion but facts Marciano is not even talked about in top 10 by most people and he was 49-0. There have been undefeated boxers in different weight classes but they not talked about like Sugar Ray Robinson, Thomas Hearns, Sugar ray Leonard, Marvin Hagler, Robert Duran I can go on and on history proves this.
     
  8. Cojimar 1946

    Cojimar 1946 Well-Known Member Full Member

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    Usyk needs to do more than that to be the eras number 1 given Fury's recent decline and the Ngannou debacle. Had Ngannou gotten the decision vs Fury that presumably wouldn't make him the eras top dog.
     
  9. MrPook

    MrPook Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Besides the stats the way in which he knocked people out matters. KTFO!!!!
     
    Last edited: Dec 24, 2023
  10. ashishwarrior

    ashishwarrior I'm vital ! Full Member

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    Fury was regarded as done wouldn't be able to get healthy
    Even some close thought it was over
    Dont give me number 2
    He was huge
    Could barely talk properly and was coming off coke
    Just stop it
     
  11. sasto

    sasto Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    That he always fought at home is a claim missing some important context. He signed a contract to fight in Moscow of all places, the fact that Povetkin couldn't pass a drug test in the land where doping is the national pass time isn't Wilder's fault.

    That's how I felt after the Fury fights. This last one I started to sour on him. Regardless of criticism of Wilder, no one could ever claim he didn't bring 100% effort and commitment before last weekend. It was a sad sight to see him just cruise to a loss, where was the guy who actually looked like he wanted to die in the ring during Fury 3?

    I agree. In 2017 you could call him a can crusher but it's a long time since then.

    Now he fights top opponent's with mixed success. Isn't that what we want to see, competitive fights?
     
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  12. Redbeard7

    Redbeard7 Boxing Addict Full Member

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    The only fighter in heavyweight championship history who retired undefeated is Marciano and he's rated higher than he would be if he were 49-1 or 50-1. Very few boxers of significance have retired undefeated. But there's no question that being defeated, especially again and again, detracts from one's legacy, other things being equal. Imagine if Frazier had retired after beating Ali; don't you think his star would shine far brighter? Of course it would.

    Obviously the manner of the losses matter too. It's one thing to lose, it's another thing to accept defeat or to be dominated.
     
    Last edited: Dec 25, 2023
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  13. Redbeard7

    Redbeard7 Boxing Addict Full Member

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    "He signed a contract to fight in Moscow of all places"

    I'm agnostic on the Wilder-Povetkin saga but the fact that the fight never happened is seen as suspicious when Wilder went on to fight Ortiz, who failed multiple drug tests previously. It's also seen by many as a bit too convenient that "whenever a threat appeared, he failed a drug test".

    But even in the most cynical case, I don't believe that Wilder personally avoided the fight.

    "In 2017 you could call him a can crusher but it's a long time since then."

    Indeed. One could make the exact same criticisms about Joshua: he targeted Wlad at 41, inactive, coming off a bad defeat, he thought Usyk would be easy because he didn't look great against Chisora and he had nowhere to go but take the rematch, plus he was the A-side in all of those fights etc. That's all true but they were still good/dangerous fights.
     
    Last edited: Dec 25, 2023
  14. ashishwarrior

    ashishwarrior I'm vital ! Full Member

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    If the name stacks up right
    I presume your ginger
    Explains alot
     
  15. KINGWILDER

    KINGWILDER Well-Known Member Full Member

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    All good points.
     
    MarkusFlorez99 likes this.