Ali vs Spinks - Who would have won a deciding rubber match?

Haven't watched either fight in many years but my memory of the rematch chimes with your description. Ali was helluva strong. See the way he manhandled Bonavena. Not here, though. He was lucky Leon was so 'distracted' during his brief reign - and lucky Spinks' corner was so chaotic.

 

Ali wouldn't have passed such an exam. His speech started to become draggy as early as '76.

 

You had two guys at that point with their own set of problems. Muhammad Ali was greatly diminished and struggling mightily to maintain his conditioning. Leon Spinks on the other hand was undisciplined and living an unclean lifestyle to go along with his inexperience. Under the circumstances it could have been anyone’s fight.

 

Most people were relieved he won and never wanted to see him box again.

 

I haven't watched the fights in quite some time, but many have said Ali was no better in the rematch than in the first bout.... and more than that, was actually worse in the rematch but it didn't matter, because Spinks only showed up in name.

 

Ali was better and Spinks worse in the rematch for mine. Haven't watched it for years tho. I wouldn't be in any hurry to watch either fight ever again.

The rematch would depend on who turned up and who on earth could predict that with either of that pair at that time? Spinks got ambushed by Coetzee in 2 minutes flat next fight and Ali wasn't seen for 2 years. It would have been one boring fight again.

 

I guess you could say Ali was “better” in the rematch in so far as not simply covering up round after round as he did in the first fight - so many rounds given away while allowing Leon to beat up on him.

When Ali finally tried to claw it back - it was too late.

Just imo also, and others might hold the same view - but Ali was shockingly close to be being put down if not put out toward the end of the fight - he certainly couldn’t walk straight to his corner after the bell ending the 15th sounded.

So for the rematch Ali knew not to f-around by laying on the ropes and he did come in better shape for greater mobility and output throughout the whole fight.

So basically, Ali in better shape with a better plan - but with the same or even less physical substantive capabilities otherwise - just imo.

 

Rather pedantic and impossible to give a 100% correct answer, but do you think Ali had even less physical capabalities? He very likely already had Parkinson's at that point, and naturally it would progress imo.

 

You’re spot on - impossible to say.

Each fight Ali had at that point likely took another and even bigger chip off him- including the first Spinks fight - and there’s the further inherent deterioration to consider from ageing and the possible progression of the disease from fight 1 to fight 2 - the fights were exactly 7 months apart.

Being exact, Ali might’ve been a little bit better off in all potential (even if unfulfilled) for the first fight but whatever his substantive condition was by Sep78, he fulfilled his potential better by coming in that much fitter and better strategised. So, in net terms, he was more effective in the rematch but, in all possibility, physiological he still could’ve been that little bit worse off.

All the fights obviously contributed to the overall damage but there’s no accounting for how much damage the Shavers fight caused by itself - taking those shots at any time is crazy, but Ali was also 35 yo with lots of extraordinary wear/tear already. That much more vulnerable.

Earnie never landed so many money shots and/or close to money shots on the one person in the one fight. Horrific really.

 

Ali v Shavers. Another fight I haven't watched in many years. Won't be watching it again, either. Ali looked older than his years here. As you know, the brass at MSG said they would not allow Ali to fight there ever again. Shame the leeches surrounding Ali - Dundee, Brown, and the rest of them - did not care about his wellbeing. Dundee - a ruthless money-mad shark.

 

Meant to ask you, Pugguy: who is the beauty in the photo?

 

Gorgeous Eleanor Parker. Sometimes I think I was born into the wrong era - arriving many decades too late. Lol.

 

Won't lie: never heard of her. Will check her out. Have a look at any Catherine Deneuve interview from 1970...