George Foreman ‘73 vs. James J. Jeffries ‘03

Foreman all day every day.

 

It is illogical. The fact is that when Foreman went into the later rounds of a fight, his power waned. That is a statement of fact, that is not me 'penalizing him' for knocking his opponents out early. Jeffries had early knockouts too. Being a HW and still being able to carry power over 20 rounds would generally be considered impressive. But when it comes to Jeffries 'he's just taking too long'. What late knockout did Foreman ever score in a competitive fight (outside of Moorer)?
That doesn't diminish the statement, Langford (a guy who was willing to fight anybody) said he wanted nothing to do with Jeffries, thats a pretty good complement any way you shake it.
Jeffries heard rumors of the PoP and he didn't care he said he wold flatten him anyway which he did.
Haha. You can't add weight to your chin buddy. Bulking up allows the fighter to deal with the HW's physicality more and (theoretically) hit a little harder, it doesn't improve your chin, thats largely a mentality and experience thing.

 

What did I say that was personal?
I'll be sure to read the Pollack books, I've been meaning to get them for a while.
Its pretty hypocritical but at this point I don't care.

 

Your talking BS Foreman was the only heavyweight to stop Peralta,he stopped a prime Moorer.

I told you Langford made that remark in1906. Jeffries carefully examined Fitzs hand and found nothing wrong with them FYI POP does not work as Cleveland Wiiliams proved in a test for SI ignore that inconvenient fact if you like it doesn't stop it being true.

 

But it’s illogical to reference Langford’s preclusion of Jeffries as any reflection of Jeff’s quality as a fighter. Jeffries drew the colour line - he wasn’t ever going to fight Langford anyway.

The sentiment appears to me to be complementary towards Jeffries.

Fitz’s wraps and gloves were checked by Jeffries himself before the rematch - this fact is specifically described in at least one contemporary article.

Which one? I would like to read it.

Re George, you’re comparing an old, beyond prime Foreman to a peak Jeffries - so fair to say that isn’t logical either.

I compared both. There you go being selective again.

Nothing suspicious. Loaded gloves or not, Fitz still had to get the punches home, and per descriptions, he did so with relative ease.

Fitz did have the advantage speed-wise and skill-wise, he was a great fighter.

 

Even if I agree with you Jeff has a better chin

Even if I agree with you Foreman didn't carry his power late.

Jeff is still getting his ass kicked. His advantage in "stamina to go 20 rounds" will not matter if he gets stopped early...! You do realize that it doesn't matter how granite your chin is if you have leaky defense, get hit a lot, and your opponent has superior technique and accuracy...?

George Chuvalo was just like Jeff: similar size, big strong guy with a granite chin and incredible endurance. It made zero difference and Foreman thrashed him early anyways.

This content is protected

 

You all have virtually no useful film of Jeffries. I have tons of film of Foreman in the 70s. What’s funniest is GF fits all the bull the Forum slings at the old timers. Hands outstretched, no defence, wide swinging, off balanced Charlie Chaplin footwork and yet he’s your messiah.

 

Jeffries is described as taking punishment as freely as a fighter like Chuvalo did.

I didn’t state that prime Frazier or Foreman’s defence was great - but it was lot better than the likes of Chuvalo or Jeffries and when tested, they upheld very good chins - but not in a manner that portrayed them as sponges for punishment on an ongoing basis.

You keep ignoring prime v prime comparisons which is a glaring omission on your part.

Post prime Ali took far more punishment in his second career - but again, he was still far more defensively adept than Jeffries - suffice to say, 2nd career Ali isn’t getting his face busted up by Fitz as Jeffries did.

My quoting Jeffries was THE statement - call that ridiculous if you want - my overlaid opinion made perfect sense.

While we’re there - what then EXACTLY was Jeff’s strategy in RENO? Please illuminate.

Did Frazier or Foreman ever say that a major component of their “strategy” was to take LOTs of punishment? Hmmm.

I clearly described the footage I was referencing - you’re clearly not understanding - footage of Jeff training for Ruhlin, 1901 - 4 mins plus worth. Combine that with the available footage from both the Sharkey and Ruhlin fights and quick check suggests 15 odd mins in total all up

I don’t have to provide references to every article I cite - look around, there have been plenty of citations before - and I don’t talk BS for the sake of an argument.

I’ve dealt with the WHOLE while your reply on the other hand has been both selective and misguided. I included the compliments afforded to Jeffries - but as I said, it was akin to describing a guy taking 50 punches in a round - and then covering off that round with a summation that he displayed terrific defence???

Doesn’t add up, right?

For another thing, what EXACTLY was the point of your highlighting the Ad in which Langford/Woodman precluded Jeffries?

I thoroughly dealt with your raising of that advertisement anyway - Sam could’ve just easily advertised to fight ANYONE without specific exception - Jeffries was obviously SELF PRECLUDED anyway.

I’m perfectly objective - but wait, are you inexplicably not understanding or pretending not to understand that there were race angles very much in play during that era?

If so, then that TRULY is ridiculous.

 

I haven't denied the SI thing. I you would post the link then I'd be happy to read it.
Moorer was a Cruiser. Size matters doesn't it?

 

That's certainly a possibility.

 

Also “late rounds power” what does that mean? It’s just stamina.

 

Late rounds power - that just means you have wind, stamina, endurance whatever word you want to use - the two aren’t separate things.

 

Nothing new here that I haven’t already addressed.

 

Sure they are interconnected. A fighters ability to throw powerful punches late in a fight is linked to their stamina. Nothing foreign about the concept mate.

 

Moorer weighed 222 lbs when he faced Foreman. You shouldn’t be projecting your own selectivity onto others and there you go again with old, well past prime Foreman - a double whammy.