Liston and Louis switch eras

I love this question. I think they both find their way to championships. I'm not sure how WW2 would have affected Liston's reign but the fact is that once Louis cleaned up all of the guys in the division he didn't have much of a challenge for a decade. I think the same would have been true for Liston.

Louis most certainly would have beaten Patterson twice, though probably not by 1st round KO. I do think Joe may have beaten Clay in 1964 but by mid to late 1965, Ali would be the dominant force in the division. God, that would have been a great trilogy.

 

Sonny was actually 29 years old in 1934.

 

Tony would be fearless, albeit outgunned, overmatched and at an insurmountable physical deficit. God bless Tony.

 

If we assume Liston is in his prime by 1936, he beats the heck out of Schmelling.
However, he probably loses to Walcott, and he loses to Charles and Marciano per sure. Other than that things stay quite the same as in Loui's timeline.

In the case of Louis, he can't do worse than Liston when facing Ali.
IMO Louis has at least 50-50 chances of beating Ali in 1964.

 

Liston doesn't do as well as Louis in the 30s and Louis does better than Sonny in the 60s but not as good as his original career. IMO Louis's era was better than Listons but Listons era had prime Ali whose the best opponent either would have to fight.

Listons resume is built on a few big wins. He won 2 12 rounders and 2 15 rounders and whether him not having more big wins is his fault I don't trust him to be dominant like Louis was. Thats not to say Liston wouldn't be champ(ignoring outside factors like discrimination)but I see him losing a few times especially in the 30s. Wouldn't surprise me to see him be a 3 time champ or even 4 time champ if hes fighting to 1952.

 

Joe Louis’s stock rises - Listons lowers.

 

I love these alt history concepts, too. I do not trust Liston to maintain the title for twelve years & twenty-five defenses - he doesn’t have nearly Louis’ discipline & the longer he goes through the division, the more complacent he’d become - trick is figuring out who he loses it to. Most of the more dangerous, name guys are early in Louis’ career…Schmeling, Baer, etc Liston would be ready for these guys. He was a hard partier though & I think he’d be upset by someone. Walcott is the easy answer but that might come about just by virtue of Liston’s age rather than slack attitude. Good news for Liston if I’m right is he’d get the distinction of first two-time champion more than likely. I’ll say Liston wins it in ‘37, loses it sometime in the next five years, then holds it for another two years perhaps until Walcott dethrones him for good.

Louis on the other hand is so disciplined, he has no fatal troubles until at least Ali. A 1964 fight is really interesting…Louis might just be fractionally past his best by then, & IMO the Ali of ’64 was a hair short of his prime. I think I’d have to favour Louis, patient enough & quick enough when the moment comes (& not caught taking Clay lightly, unlike Liston).

If I’m correct, then things get interesting thereafter. Louis has already double KO’d Patterson at this point, & possibly beaten Johansson, too. My best guess is Ali goes on a run after losing to Louis & forces a rematch a year or two later where Father Time gives a winning smile to the reflexes of Ali. The end.

 

I agree that Sonny would have a tougher time in Louis's era---guys like Walcott and Charles would give him trouble for sure.

 

Truth be told, I think in Louis’ era a Sonny Liston with his criminal background (and recurring problems with the law) probably gets blackballed and never gets a title shot.

 

Liston got into trouble with the law. Louis broke the color line. Would Liston have gotten the chance to break the color line as an ex-con?

I think the big impact would have been the boxing color line would not have been broken until after World War II at the same time the color lines in baseball, football, and basketball were being broken.

My guess is Liston would not have gotten shots at white fighters and would have been restricted to the "chitlin circuit"--black fighters fighting other black fighters. He might be remembered today somewhat the same as Elmer Ray. Someone no one has seen a film of who had an intriguing record.

A Louis born in 1934 would have become champion. The big question is would he have gotten there in time to fight Marciano, or would he have succeeded Marciano?

 

Sonny Liston lights up Marciano like a Cuban cigar and puts him out in an ash tray by round 4

 

Like he did against Marty Marshall,Ali, Leotis Martin or even against guy he won like Machen and Whitehurst?