Who else is qualified for the status of GOAT?

I admit it's a bit of a reach but: ATG. Most title defenses in FW history, great record/resume, very highly touted in his heyday, just as great as Pep. Criminally underrated imo.

 

I think Langford fought more white HWs than Jack Johnson did(I haven't counted that is just my impression). He certainly fought more than Willis, Jeanette or McVea did.

He was given the chance to fight for 2 HW world titles. Its on modern people who refuse to acknowledge those oppurtunities. Even if you don't acknowledge his titles there were many authorities acknowledging his status.

 

1) Greb by resume. With two good eyes in 1919, he was a monster.

2) Gans on film. Also, because Fitz and Langford said so. At Goldfield, he decked Nelson with a single hook and a single right. During the classic Championship Distance era, that one probably would've been stopped in the 15th. Then, in torrid desert summer heat bordering 100 F, The Old Master, then a veteran of 187 bouts, continued to pick apart the Durable Dane for another 27 rounds before Nelson quit with that blatant low blow. Nobody at LW is beating Joe Gans under those conditions and rule set.

3) SRR at 147. Against Sammy Angott, he looked like a stalking Hearns. He carried Fusari in his WW finale, but catch how he goes inside to ravage the taller Bobby Dykes to the body, thudding it with surgical rights. Outside, inside, moving or stalking, out boxing boxers or outslugging sluggers, he could do it all. If his LHW challenge of Maxim had indeed been postponed as was considered to let a stifling heat wave pass, he'd have won the title at 175 rather easily, and then retired. (He was sane enough not to try defending against Moore.

4) Post Robinson, my P4P #1 is forever and always Duran. He pounded down DeJesus twice, won Montreal in the first ten rounds (where the bigger and younger SRL did fight the sort of fight he had been fighting - I agreed with UPI that Duran won nine of the first ten stanzas), decked and dominated Palomino in retiring Carlos, and was beating a peaking MMH after 13 rounds. (No question he was better over 12 than SRL was against a slowed and aging Marv.) KO Magazine stated after Palomino that Duran "May be invincible when in prime condition." I think he was. I do wonder what Duran would've achieved with an SRL work ethic. At the end of round 11 in their rubber match, a Duran right opened up a 60 stitch gash over SRL's left eye. If there had been four more scheduled rounds, would Ray have gotten to the final bell?

5) Langford. As the taller boxer with the longer arms, he stuck and moved stylishly in getting the better of Barbados Joe Walcott. When aging, he one punched Wills twice. When blind, he sensed and knocked out Tiger Flowers. Jeannette X in Paris was filmed, and he dispelled the stereotype that he was a ten round fighter. Terrific battering scoring multiple KDs in round 15.

 

Excellent post. Roberto Duran is without question the best fighter I have ever seen or most likely will ever see. What the man achieved is simply amazing and I dont believe we will see his like again.

Robinson is in the running in p4p but IMO is often over rated and people simply go with concensus. Greb has the best resume in boxing history, Langford was an unreal talent, and Pep stat wise I think was the best ever. But p4p is all about ones criteria.

 

Langfords' early fights/six round to 1 round exhibition "staged fights" are to poorly documented for p4p status. Ray robinson and Greb were going full 15 rounders early on..

 

Cant say that I agree, all other factors considered Langford was avoided like the plague fr good reason. Other fighters knew how good he was.

 

I would guess than the number 2 on everyone's list. The list of all time great is so subjective. I suppose the way to come up with a number one is to make a list and the person who ends up number one is your all time great and then, we can average out whom everyone else says is the number one greatest and that person who is the number one (by majority)is the greatest ever in opinion.

 

Just curious, where would you all place Benny Leonard? I’m sure most agree that he’s not in the conversation for GOAT but what about top 5 or top 10?

 

Tank Davis is clearly number 1…at least according to quite a few people on Facebook.

 

Thanks for the reply! I’ve always been a big Benny Leonard fan (or at least since I started researching boxing history, as opposed to just keeping up with current fighters). I feel like people often forget him when they are talking about the top P4P boxers in history. Even when just talking about fighters at lightweight, it seems like so many people will list guys like Duran, Mayweather, Whitaker, Chavez, etc as the best ever in the division, and they either simply forget about Leonard or just don’t realize how good he was. I feel like Gans is often forgotten about at lightweight as well. I’m sure a lot of it probably just has to do with how long ago these guys fought, which means the more casual fans aren’t going to be as familiar with them, especially Gans who started his pro career in the early 1890s.

 

Yeah but in reality Wilder would absolutely murder Robinson in a boxing match an just everyone else like Armstrong, Duran , Pep an all the other non heavyweights a that is not subjective. That’s why pound for pound talk never includes heavyweights except maybe sometimes Ali because it was created because everyone knew the best fighters were heavyweights cos of their size strength an power an so they created it to give the non heavyweight their dues an recognition

Anyone guess who was the last heavyweight that was considered the consensus pound for pound best fighter in the world at the time they were fighting?

 

Ha You seriously think Pep an Armstrong would beat Wilder in a boxing match? What the hell has happened to the posters here?

 

I’m pretty sure several legitimate publications had Tyson rated as P4P # 1 for a while prior to the loss to Buster Douglas. I think Holyfield was # 1 for a short period as well, and Lennox Lewis was at least in the top 3 to 5 for a pretty long time (and he may have hit # 1 at some point during his career). I’m almost positive that some legitimate sources had Usyk at first on their P4P list after his first or second fight with AJ. I’m pretty sure both Fury and AJ have reached the top 5 at some point in their careers. Other heavyweight fighters who likely reached # 1 P4P status at least once in their careers would include Ali, Joe Louis, Dempsey, John L Sullivan, Jack Johnson, James J Jeffries, and probably some others I’m not thinking of. That doesn’t mean any of these guys were ever unanimously considered the best P4P fighter at any point, just that at least one legitimate publication or boxing analyst rated them as such (for example, that would include sources like ESPN, Ring Magazine, the Transnational Boxing Rankings Board, etc in today’s time).