Why did Tommy Hearns fight Hagler's fight?

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by Dorrian_Grey, May 11, 2024.


  1. PernellSweetPea

    PernellSweetPea Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Very true. I remember Gil saying when it comes to Hearns when he throw his opponent should throw, when he doesn't they should throw. Almost like Tommy loved the offense too much. Tommy knew how good Roberto's chin was, so when he knocked him out it went to his head a little and he thought well I knocked out Roberto I can do the same to Marvin. Different style and weight a little higher. But Tommy's style for the knockout and Marvin going for the knockout made for this unbelievable fight. I sometimes think if you had all fighters come out like Tommy and Marvin did in 1985 most of those fights wouldn't get out of round one. Angelo Dundee said he was surprised it made it to the end of round one.
     
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  2. PernellSweetPea

    PernellSweetPea Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    I have a hard time believing that leg massage story. Tommy fought 41 times before Marvin and they didn't massage his legs before those fights and give him weak legs? All of a sudden one of the biggest fights he had and biggest in the 1980s comes up and they massage his legs. I love Tommy but this leg massage stuff never meant much to me, even if it was true. That wouldn't matter. Tommy let some guy massage his legs and then pays the price. Where was Emanuel during this important time when his fighter is getting ready for the fight. With Ray and Duran it might have worked, but intuitively people could tell Hearns loved to go for broke for some reason and brawl and land and if he were pushed into a corner he fought back like with Ray and other fights. And Marvin was tired at the beginning of round 3. As Leonard said on the HBO broadcast Marvin was arm weary, and he was exhausted. People don't talk of this because Tommy was even more exhausted, but had that been Ray or Duran in there they could have kept up the pace. Not hit Marvin as hard or done as much damage at that point, but they were just different styles. Marvin gambled and won.
     
  3. Anubis

    Anubis Boxing Addict

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    Only if the ringside physician had immediately stopped the fight upon checking that cut, but he didn't want to be physically dismembered by thousands of enraged and cheated fans.
     
  4. Anubis

    Anubis Boxing Addict

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    Marv only wanted Tommy's body and got it. That's where Tommy legs weakened so quickly.
     
  5. Anubis

    Anubis Boxing Addict

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    After what Tommy did to Cuevas and Duran, it never occurred to him that somebody could simply charge through his best shot and have it break his right hand instead. Marv may have had the best chin in boxing history. After all those bouts and all those blasting shots from the likes of Hearns and Cyclone Hart, he actually moved to Italy and learned Italian well enough to be a successful action movie star in that country, eventually speaking English with an Italian accent. That's insane. (During his career, he couldn't even pronounce Vito's last name correctly.)

    I don't think he was gambling that much. He saw what SRL did to Tommy's body late in their WW unification bout, and knew Hearns was vulnerable there. Forced Tommy to fight 12 rounds in the first three minutes. This wasn't Leon Spinks tearing after Coetzee in round one. Marv was a veteran who knew what he was doing, and with SRL seemingly completely out of the picture at that time, this was MMH's legacy bout. He threw everything into it and was never the same. The only thing left was to go after Monzon's record of 14 defenses. (In fact, Hagler did technically post the most official defenses of the Undisputed MW Championship, but we all know Carlos was the true MW King during the WBA custodianship by Rodrigo Valdez.)
     
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  6. Dorrian_Grey

    Dorrian_Grey It came to me in a dream Full Member

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    The reason I always find Hagler so hard to get a read on is because of the Hearns fight. The Hearns fight was the exception to the rule of how Hagler performed in big fights. Antuofermo 1, Duran, Mugabi, SRL, all of which were big, important fights for Marvin and all of which he underperformed in in some way. Except for Hearns, for Tommy, Marvin fought like a man on fire, like a man possessed by a demon. He was a perpetual motion machine for those furious eight minutes, but never before or again would he reach such heights. He came in with a good plan and perfect execution but he fought in a style which was so alien to how he fought in nearly all his other fights. Because of The Fight now the enduring image of Hagler is as a come-forward, seek and destroy pressure fighter, but he wasn't that at all, he was a cagey boxer-puncher who slowly worked away at and broke down his opponents. Hagler blamed silk pyjamas, being past his prime, and being robbed for the reason he lost to SRL, but, really, he gave away so many concessions to Leonard with the bigger ring and fewer rounds for bigger pay that he shot himself in the foot before the first bell even rang. Then he wastes the first 4 rounds fighting orthodox like he did against Mugabi and doesn't adapt to realise that Leonard knew he would do that and had planned accordingly. Hagler thought he could waltz in and just starch Leonard because of his ring-rust and the fact he was the smaller man but he never fought with any real urgency and did a horrible job of cutting the ring. I never really know how to feel about Hagler, he's the only one of the four kings I just can't fully form a concrete perception of or really have deep feelings about.
     
  7. Anubis

    Anubis Boxing Addict

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    Mugabe and Hearns left him with not too much more. Mugabe was a war of attrition where MMH absorbed everything the Beast could unload in the Ugandan's greatest performance, without taking a backwards step.

    In the corners, while Angelo Dundee is screaming to SRL, "That's it! That's it! Be my MAN!" and keeping the increasingly fatigued Ray continually hyped up, the Petronellis were being the church mice which Angie very appropriately always was with George Foreman. If Pat and Goody had given Marv the same sense of urgency, they might have lit that fire under Hagler which he badly needed just then. Marv always loved and revered them, kissing their coffins at their funerals in 2011 and 2012. In previous bouts, he talked about listening to them between rounds.

    SRL-Hagler may have been Angelo's best performance as a corner man, always keeping his charge pumped up when he needed it. Inspiration between rounds ought not to be underestimated.

    Hagler never gave Manny Steward the chance to do that with Hearns. By the time Tommy returned to his corner before round two, the damage was already done. Then, the cut occurred, and Hearns was doomed before the bell ending the round. It wasn't just Tommy who never had a chance, but Manny had no opportunity between rounds to offer any assistance when it mattered. He couldn't say "Go after that cut!," before Hearns was down and out.
     
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  8. he grant

    he grant Historian/Film Maker

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    I agree the story is hard to swallow but this is Manny and he seemed to be usually a straight shooter ... I don't remember Hagler so tired but I'll check it out again from that lens ...
     
  9. Anubis

    Anubis Boxing Addict

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    Marv gassed late in his draw with Antuofermo. Vito ran five miles every day though, and had lungs like beer kegs.
     
  10. Saintpat

    Saintpat Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Not to mention that handsome profile.
     
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  11. he grant

    he grant Historian/Film Maker

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    I agree Marvin had stamina questions about himself ... if you watch his first Fully Obel defense he almost punched himself out ... He was cautious against Vito, Duran and Leonard ...
     
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  12. Anubis

    Anubis Boxing Addict

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    Meanwhile, Monzon famously smoked while training, as Locche smoked between rounds. (I call El Intocable "Nicotino Roacche"...)
     
  13. Dorrian_Grey

    Dorrian_Grey It came to me in a dream Full Member

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    I'm still fascinated how Monzon could smoke daily, drink and party often, and fight a solid chunk of his career with a bullet in his shoulder and still go 80+ fights unbeaten. If you took any other ATG, shot them in the shoulder, made them smoke daily and live a party lifestyle, then asked them to go on an 80 fight unbeaten streak, I struggle to think of any ATG who would win as often under such circumstances as Monzon did. Nicotino Roacche is funny as hell as well. Mayorga smoked in training as well right? Might make a thread about best boxers who were smokers.
     
  14. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member

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    Hagler was on his chest from the get go,he had no chance to box.
     
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  15. nyterpfan

    nyterpfan Active Member Full Member

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    OUTSTANDING post! Honestly, this is one of the best I've read on the entire Classic Boxing forum! BRAVO!!

    The only thing I might add is that I think there was a healthy dislike brewing between these two during the pre fight buildup and I think Hagler (like Duran against SRL in their first bout) was FANATICALLY focused and hell-bent to show Hearns he was the tougher badass!! It ultimately boiled down to that!!