Rank these 8 Mexican bantamweight greats

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by Jel, May 16, 2020.


  1. Jel

    Jel Obsessive list maker Full Member

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    Between 1969 and 1979, the world bantamweight championship was more or less the national property of Mexico. Starting with Ruben Olivares' crushing defeat of Lionel Rose and ending with Lupe Pintor's controversial win over Carlos Zarate, the world title (particularly the WBC version) seemed to be fought for as part of a round robin tournament between Mexican 118 pounders.

    In the early 70s, after Olivares' original ascension to the top, you had El Puas, Chuco Castillo and Rafael Herrera all doing battle against each other. Once Olivares moved north to Featherweight, Herrera continued on by doing battle with Rodolfo Martinez and Romeo Anaya. By the mid-70s, Martinez continued the lineage before Alfonso Zamora and Carlos Zarate took over. And once Zarate had proven his superiority, Zarate and Pintor did battle for the national/world title with Pintor continuing Mexico's dominance into the 80s.

    So, given their many fights and title reigns, in what order would you place the aforementioned fighters in terms of bantamweight greatness?

    A reminder of the fighters, in rough chronological order:
    Ruben Olivares
    Chuco Castillo
    Rafael Herrera
    Rodolfo Martinez
    Romeo Anaya
    Alfonso Zamora
    Carlos Zarate
    Lupe Pintor
     
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  2. asero

    asero Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Ruben Olivares
    Carlos Zarate
    Chuco Castillo
    Alfonso Zamora
    Rafael Herrera
    Rodolfo Martinez
    Lupe Pintor
    Romeo Anaya
     
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  3. Jel

    Jel Obsessive list maker Full Member

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    Nice. I was expecting to see Olivares on top and Anaya at the bottom - the rest of the list is much more nebulous, isn't it?
     
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  4. Jel

    Jel Obsessive list maker Full Member

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    Bumping this from a few years back.

    Any thoughts on the order?

    Also, what about the great fights these boxers had against each other and also fighting for the bantamweight title against other opposition.

    What were the best battles?
     
  5. Greg Price99

    Greg Price99 Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Olivares
    Zarate
    Herrera
    Castillo
    Pintor
    Zamora
    Martinez
    Anaya

    On the night he fought Rose, Olivares may well have been the best BW ever.
     
    Last edited: May 17, 2024
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  6. scartissue

    scartissue Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Olivares
    Zarate
    Herrera
    Castillo
    Martinez
    Zamora
    Pintor
    Anaya
     
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  7. Kid Bacon

    Kid Bacon All-Time-Fat Full Member

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    1) Olivares. No contest here.
    2) Chucho Castillo
    3) Carlos Zarate
    4) Lupe Pintor
    5) Rafael Herrera
    6 - 8) Everybody else
     
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  8. Flo_Raiden

    Flo_Raiden Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Ruben Olivares
    Carlos Zárate
    Chuco Castillo
    Lupe Pintor
    Rafael Herrera
    Rodolfo Martinez
    Alfonso Zamora
    Romeo Anaya
     
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  9. AntonioMartin1

    AntonioMartin1 Jeanette Full Member

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    I would sya until 1983 because Pintor was pretty dominating as a champion too.
     
  10. AntonioMartin1

    AntonioMartin1 Jeanette Full Member

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    Olivares
    Zarate
    Pintor
    Herrera
    Castillo
    Martinez
    Zamora
    Anaya

    Zamora is one of those guys who is almost a hall of famer.

    Almost.
     
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  11. Jel

    Jel Obsessive list maker Full Member

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    Thanks Greg and Scar.

    I had the same top 4 in the same order and also Anaya at the bottom of the 8. I think you can make an argument for any order for 5, 6 and 7. I personally like Pintor a lot but he was a bit fortunate to get the nod over Zarate to win the title in the first place and I think he came right at the end of that great era so didn’t have quite as tough competition as Martinez or Zamora, perhaps.

    What an incredible era it was. I wish I’d been around to experience it at the time.

    @scartissue - not meaning to be presumptuous, but do you have any particular special memories of that era of Mexican bantams?
     
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  12. Jel

    Jel Obsessive list maker Full Member

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    Well, yes, that’s true. Pintor’s title reign went on until the end of 1982 or effectively until he challenged Gomez at super bantam but I see that final title change between Zarate and Pintor as being the natural end point of Mexico’s dominance of the era and that level of competition between Mexican fighters at the weight.
     
  13. Jel

    Jel Obsessive list maker Full Member

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    As I said in my reply to @Greg Price99 and @scartissue, I see a top 4 of Olivares, Zarate, Herrera and Castillo so the only difference is you’ve slotted Pintor in the middle. As much as I like him, I’m not sure Pintor’s title reign would have lasted as long if he had been competing with the bantams of the earlier 70s like Olivares, Castillo and Herrera.

    But all the fighters who held the title were tremendous in their way, even if we all agree that Olivares was the best of them and Anaya was the least of them.
     
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  14. Jel

    Jel Obsessive list maker Full Member

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  15. scartissue

    scartissue Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    @Jel I went head long into boxing around the time Olivares was fighting Valentin Galeano and Jesus Pimental, so I was in awe of him. Despite him losing to Herrera, I didn't have a grudge against Rafael for beating my hero, I truly appreciated his style and the fact he was such a strong bantamweight. And his wars with Rodolfo Martinez and Venice Borkorsor were something else. When Zarate was coming up, there wasn't anyone who didn't feel like this was the bantamweight version of Sonny Liston on the way. Also, like Liston, one of the few times the challenger was the favorite when he fought Martinez. Speaking of Martinez, when they felt he was ready to be taken and time to usher in the next sure-thing, he turned the tables and showed that the old man still had some talent there when he took apart young Mike Ayala in 7. Also, the first time I saw Chucho Castillo fight I was so impressed with his counter-punching. It was his second fight with Herrera and it was a real clinic on boxing. Herrera, so strong, but any mishap, any miss, anything wild at all, Castillo nailed him with a counter. I scored that bout a draw and hold it up today as a showpiece. I met Herrera years later and asked about his first fight with Castillo. I knew nothing other than he was stopped in 3 and the result intrigued me. I asked, "was it stopped on a cut." He didn't play or make excuses he said, "No, he knocked me out."
    Also, this era produced some fantastic Mexican contenders like Pimental, Rogelio Lara, Julio Guerrero and Famoso Gomez. I'm rambling here, dude, but this was a fantastic era for me.