Usyk would beat Ali

Im not taking a side but isn’t Zhang like 41 years old? When Ali lost to Spinks he was younger than Usyk, Frazier lost to foreman at 32 and was considered done. George was Usyk’s age (okay a little older at 38) when he started his senior tour comeback. He was in his late 20’s, I think 28 when he hung it up the first time. He was 42 when he lost to Evander, almost 46 when he beat Moore and 48 when he hung it up. I don’t see that happening ever again with today’s fighters. George was as slow as I’ve ever seen in those days but no one was able to KO him and he could put a beat down on some guys.

Different eras and the former era took a toll on fighters. They would fight three or four times a year and take a pounding. It’s really hard to compare boxing eras becaiee the older era forced guys to fight hurt or not fully recovered from their previous fight.

I’m not slagging older era (my era! Or saying modern guys are soft. It’s just different and hard to compare. Fury probably has a hundred million bucks. How do guys stay motivated when they are super rich? Also, modern top money fighters rarely fight hurt, or go into a fight injured. They just reschedule as Fury just did. And modern fighters frequently fight once a year or so when they get to the top. This was very rare in the old days.

I loved old school heavyweight fighting but I’m glad the new generation cares about safety at least among top fighters. Better nutrition, better medical services and better PEDs for sure. It’s hard and often unfair to make direct comparisons. Fury and Usyk would have given any of the all time greats a tough fight and vice versa. The level of technical boxing in their fight was top notch.

 

I think all in all you have to have a balanced opinion.

Would Usyk be very successful in the 70s ? Absolutely. Do I see him beating everyone in that era ? No. I think Frazier, Ali, Holmes, would be very troubling opponents for him.

The thing is Usyk is a great talent but hes not unbeatable, a fighter like Breidis who is similar size to 70s Heavyweights gave Usyk a very close competitive fight using effective aggression.

One would assume the way to beat Usyk is being an elite pressure fighter who can keep up the pace for 12 rounds, hence that's why I think fighters like Frazier, Tyson, would have effective styles vs Usyk.

Just to finally point out I think Usyk vs Ali would be a very competitive fight that would go the distance but I favour Ali why ? Because Ali has proven himself against other Great/ATG Heavyweights. Usyk has beaten bigger Heavyweights in which he deserves alot of credit, but I still don't think he has beaten any fighter that I would consider a great or an ATG. Hence I don't think he should automatically be a favourite over the very best Heavyweights of all time.

 

So you must rate Fury to make that assumption?

 

This isn’t a good example. Size 100% matters but of course the bigger guy needs to have skill. Fury is a significantly better boxer than Valuev.

At smaller weights a 5-10lb advantage matters. At heavyweight a 20+lbs weight advantage absolutely matters, let alone 40lbs. Size advantages don’t just disappear when you hit 200lbs lol

You’re appearing to downplay Fury’s weight advantage. He’s naturally a huge guy who carries a bit of a fat on him all the time.

Wilder’s a freak of nature with insane power in his right hand. This doesn’t take away from the fact a non punching cruiser weight Usyk overcome a 40lb weight advantage, 6-7 inch reach advantage and a 5-6 inch height advantage. Ali did nothing of the sort. What big slick boxer did Ali beat? He beat for the most part slow/same sized/smaller plodders

I’m not saying you can’t hurt someone being 20-40lbs smaller. I’m saying the heavier guy naturally had the advantage of better punch resistance, strength and usually more power. And this couple with significant height and reach advantages, is a big advantage, and very difficult to overcome, especially when the big guy is skilled.

 

He’s just completely downplaying the height/size/ reach advantage

 

Dude, you’re the biased one.

You’re comparing way smaller crippled Patterson to way taller Fury.

Ali never took on someone with half the size/reach/height advantage that Fury had

 

Yes Fury is an ATG and looked the best he's looked in a long while in the fight Usyk was just better

 

The only slick boxer Ali "beat" was Young and Norton and he had difficulties with both and got gift decisions against both

 

How is Fury an ATG when hes only beaten 3 ranked fighters ? That's not the achievements or resume of an ATG.

Fury is not even close to an ATG his resume is paper thin.

 

In his Prime Ali had faster hands than Usyk, his footwork was even better and durable than Usyk's imo. Besides he had a granite jaw and incredible stamina. Usyk instead has more powerful combos than Ali and a better IQ ring.

(Ali after Foreman is all another story).

However...I think in Ali's Prime the bout could end with a draw or a SD for one of the two with scores by the judges very close.

 

How is he not was an undisputed lineal champ and was clearly the best fighter of the new gen until Usyk beat him he might not have the deepest resume but still a solid one and had the skillset to give any fighter a tough fight H2H

 

Again how can he be an ATG with such a paper thin resume with only 3 wins against ranked opposition ?

Show me another fighter who is regarded as an ATG with such statistics ?

I don't think Fury ever proved he was the best of this era he beat an old Wladimir at the end of his career, a limited Wilder who recently lost 12-0 to Parker, and Whyte who had already been KO'ed twice.

He just lost clearly to Usyk and never fought the likes Parker, Zhang, Joshua, etc.

Hes not even proved hes the number 2 of this era yet with Joshua possibly being a slight favourite to beat him now and having a slightly stronger resume overall.

 

Based on skills and eye test he def looked much better then Joshua for most of his reign and showed much better skills

 

Based on eye test he struggled immensely with limited Wilder in 2 fights being dropped 4 times, struggled immensely vs a non top 10 Heavyweight Wallin who Joshua destroyed, and recently arguably lost to an MMA fighter who again Joshua recently destroyed.

Fury has always looked beatable and struggled in numerous fights, if he hadn't been so inactive and fought more top 10 fighters I'm pretty sure he would have lost already.

I'm not taking anything away from Usyk he beat a very good Heavyweight and with the size difference it's an even better win with that added context.

But we don't have to exaggerate and claim Fury is an ATG when he clearly isn't......

 

no, he wouldn't. ali was just a lil better in every dpt.
everyone seems to not be taking into account that the reason there are many more bigger men today, is because you dont need to have 15 rd stamina. that completely changes the talent pool youre gonna pick from. endurance lost value, making size more desirable. importance of accumulation and pace, took a backseat to 1 punch ko deliveries and energy management. usyks 3rd gear, is ali kicking it out of 1st.