In your opinion what does it take to be a champion?

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by GlaukosTheHammer, May 29, 2024.


  1. GlaukosTheHammer

    GlaukosTheHammer Boxing Addict banned Full Member

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    I'm just curious.

    If a fighter is considered the best of his era to such an extreme consensus one finds it difficult to find anyone suggesting they are anything but the clear and far away leader of the pack both in contemporary text and hindsight, but because of societal worries was never crowned champion, do you consider that fighter a champion?

    Some food for thought.

    While I personally lean toward what was then is now, as in a champion declared in say 1730 can not be stripped in 2024.

    That said, that's already done. If you accept James Figg to Pipes to Taylor as the English BK lineage you've cut 3 champions people at that time called champions because historians at CBZ/IBRO decided though the men were called champion it was unclear who was best.

    So, there is precedence for retroactively stripping.

    I do not know of a precedence for retro active elevation to champion.


    I am curious about opinions but it seem my KB is onn it's last days so I can not easily type out more .. I hhope this enough to ppose the questionn and I apologize for the text. I know what it lloooks like but I'mmmm really having a hard time fixinng it so, sssorrry buds.
     
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  2. thistle

    thistle Boxing Junkie

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    the things that go without saying...

    Willingness,
    Heart
    Skill
    Toughness
    Durability
    Dedication
    Seriousness
    Stamina
    FITNESS!!!

    the things that aren't always spoken Out Loud or often times naively unknown by many...

    OWNERSHIP
    Backing
    Marketing
    PROTECTION

    VESTED Interests!!!
     
  3. Melankomas

    Melankomas Corbett beats your favourite fighter

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  4. Greg Price99

    Greg Price99 Boxing Addict Full Member

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    The questions posed in the content of this post weren't what I was expecting when I read the thread title.

    The two posts in this thread before mine appear to answer the question posed in the thread title, I'll answer those posed within the content of this post:

    I distinguish between champion and the best/greatest, respecting the reality at the time of the former and forming my own opinion on the latter.

    E.g. I don't consider that Ezzard Charles was ever LHW world champion, because he wasnt. I do consider that he was not only the best LHW of his era, but the greatest LHW of all time, based solely on fights contested in that division.
     
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  5. lufcrazy

    lufcrazy requiescat in pace

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    To be a champion, for me, you have to have the best championship claim.

    That's my unifying theory of boxing.

    For example, Ali gets stripped of WBA for rematching Liston. He's clearly still the champion in my eyes.

    DM has the lineage but RJJ unifies all the belts, that's debatable as to what you value more.

    At LMW today Fundora has just beaten the top ranked fighter and then is about to vacate his belt. Again it's murky.
     
  6. Clinton

    Clinton Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Glad ur back, G!
     
  7. Saintpat

    Saintpat Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    To be the man, you’ve got to beat the man. (Woo!)

    To be the champ, you’ve got to beat the champ.

    Or, if the title is vacant, the designated other top guy you’re paired with.

    I mean, that’s pretty much it. To claim a championship, you dethrone a sitting champ or, if that title is vacant, you best the person who is designated alongside you as the most worthy available person to fight for it.

    We can of course debate who those should be, but whoever recognizes the title gets to determine that. It is, in perfect fact, their championship (whoever they are, meaning whatever body sanctions and recognizes the result as being for that title).

    If it’s the lineal world championship, you beat the lineal champ. Or if the lineage is broken, it’s generally considered that when you defeat the other top person or persons who might have a claim then you’ve started a new lineage.

    If it’s the NABF championship, you beat the NABF champ or whomever the NABF puts forth as the other worthy person for you to fight for it. If it’s the vacant New York State paperweight championship, it’s whomever the New York athletic commission sanctions as being worthy to fight for it.

    That doesn’t mean the best fighter in that weight in North America for the NABF, because the best fighter in North America may not hold that belt … maybe the world champ is from North America but he has no interest in that belt since he’s world champion. Likewise, highly-ranked contenders or world champs from New York wouldn’t fight for the mere state title.

    In the UK, I’m pretty sure guys traditionally had to vacate British titles to fight for a world championship … even if they end up losing the world title challenge, they are no longer, at that point, British champ. I’m not sure if they have to give it up to fight for a Euro title, but I’m pretty sure they do if they win the Euro title as they’re now ‘above’ Brit level.

    Etc.
     
  8. Richard M Murrieta

    Richard M Murrieta Now Deceased 2/4/25 Full Member

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    Hunger, dedication, maturity, confidence, both mental and physical conditioning.
     
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  9. Fergy

    Fergy Walking Dead Full Member

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    I'd say this!
     
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  10. Flo_Raiden

    Flo_Raiden Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Consistency
    Fighting other champions
    Dedicated to the game
    Strong mentality
    Willpower
    Self confidence
    Courage
    Skills
    Great physical condition
     
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  11. Hotep Kemba

    Hotep Kemba Active Member Full Member

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    In literal terms, just genetics, a BIT of hard work and a lot of luck. If Andy Ruiz can become champion then intangibles and hard work can't be all that important lol. Hell boxers are actually some of, if not the least disciplined sportsman on the planet due to how infrequently they need to fight these days. Jermell Charlo went two years straight without having a fight and he was still champion.

    A lot of boxers become champion and then slack HARD immediately afterwards, with Duran (and Ruiz, Fury) coming to mind again. You don't see that as often from greats in other sports. Ditto with fighters like Hyrgovic who sniff a title shot and then become extremely inactive.
     
  12. Marvelous_Iron

    Marvelous_Iron Active Member Full Member

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    They have to have lost

    How many champions would have lost twice like Patterson did to Liston and came back for more

    The thrilla may be the greatest championship bout to ever take place

    Louis, Marciano, Tyson, plenty others were never up against something like either of those events/scenarios, and in that sense have an unproven element to them
     
  13. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member

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    Talent,focus,dedication,self belief.determination, circumstances,connections.
    I should think keeping hold of a title once you have won it would be harder than winning it, to retain the mindset of a top contender, and that focus and dedication,would then become most important.