Holyfield beat a better version of Foreman than Ali did

Highly doubt that. I'm not even sure he'll beat Morrison, let alone that he KO's him in 1 or 2 rounds.

 

That's cause 90s Foreman fought better opposition

 

Are you being serious?

 

3 differences

Moorer and Holyfield were top 5 HWs for their era and Lennox was not that far ahead of them. Bonavena, Ellis and Quarry weren't as close to the best guys.

Patterson retired at 37 and the age gaps were smaller in your examples. Ellis was only 5 years younger. Patterson became champ in the 50s but he was super young.

Sonny Liston exists

 

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Moorer would not even crack my top 10 for the decade. Patterson had far more wear and tear than Foreman and Holmes and turned pro at a younger age so obviously that would affect how they age.

Foremans 10 year retirement and Holmes not turning pro till age 23 obviously impacts how quickly they decline

 

This is arguably the most ludicrous idea, that I have ever seem put fort on this forum, and I have been here longer than most.

 

What is your top 10 for the 90s? I find it very difficult to put Moorer lower than 6th.



Lennox, Bowe, Holyfield,Foreman, Tyson. Golota?

 

Frazier wasn’t the same after FOTC but, just imo, the overriding take away from the Foreman fight wasn’t so much about Joe’s deteriorations and particular conditioning (or lack thereof) for that fight as it was about a horrible stylistic match up.

Remember, Ali rematched Joe in 74. So Joe not only had the damage incurred during FOTC to be getting on with - he also had the damage incurred during his brutal loss to Foreman.

Some have reasoned that Ali of the 74 Frazier rematch was better off than the rusty 71 version who fought Frazier in only Ali’s 3rd fight back in after a 3.5 year exile.

So, by the time of their rematch, with Joe perceived as irreparably damaged and Ali as an improved version of his 71 self - certainly Ali was in his best possible condition during his comeback, one might’ve calculated Ali to have a far easier time against Joe than he did.

Sure, Ali won the rematch by a good margin but really, it was Ali’s repeated punch and hold tactics throughout the fight that were his main advantage.

Without same, the Frazier rematch would’ve been a much tougher and closer fight - as was the case in Manila when Padilla duly policed Muhammad and didn’t allow Ali to hold.

Comparing young Foreman to old Foreman involves different pros and cons for each version but I would definitely rate young Foreman as the much superior fighter in net terms.

Of course the biggest con for the young Foreman was the fatigue factor. Not too much of a problem for young Foreman if he could whack you out in say 5-6 rounds - but a BIG problem for George against any opponent who could hang tough for that long and still remain reasonably viable.

Finally, old George was built and styled to only ever look relatively impressive against Holyfield over the long haul - not so much a big chance to actually win.

Young Foreman, however, was very much built and styled to put Evander out by or before the mid rounds - and do so in formidable fashion.

Ali beat (and KO’d) a far more lethal version of Foreman than the one Holyfield decisioned over 12 rounds.

 

Correct.

 

Not better…. Just different and more fitting for the circumstances he was in

 

Old Foreman had just better stamina and that's it.

Young Foreman had speed,power, strenght and was very agressive fighter that's why he knocked out everyone so fast.
Had he fight in the 90s, he would whoop everyone.

 

He could beat some people 70s GF couldn’t but not really - he nearly lost to Dwight Qawi. If Qawi came in, in shape he’d have derailed his comeback.
I actually think Qawi could’ve not would’ve beat 70s Foreman. It’s very possible he makes him look silly and counter punches him all night.
But people seem to think heavyweights are immune to light heavyweights/190lbers for some reason despite the evidence. There are advantages to being smaller it’s why guys trained down in weight - even heavyweights at one time.
It also wasn’t so much his corner who were all very intelligent as it was GF having no other options.

 

70s Foreman was physically superior but he did fight awful in the Ali fight. 90s Foreman was much slower and less dangerous but he was more relaxed and didn’t gas out.