Did Marvis Fraizer have any potential?

He would've been better off fighting at Cruiserweight I think he was a bit undersized at Heavyweight and didn't have the durability at the very highest level. I can excuse the 1st round loss to a prime Tyson but losing to Holmes in the 1st round ? Ok Holmes is an ATG but he wasn't a big puncher and wasn't known for getting guys of there early.

All in all though I think Marvis is a bit underrated because of the 1st round losses. He had some decent wins Broad, Bugner, Tillis, Ribalta, Bonecrusher. The Bonecrusher win is a standout win for me because he survived Bonecrusher swarming him in the 1st round similar to Bonecrusher vs Witherspoon 2. So that showed me Marvis had some heart and ability to overcome that crisis.

The issue is Joe wanted his son Marvis to fight like him and he didn't have the power, physicality, or durability. He was much better suited to being a tricky boxer which was his natural style.

Overall I think Marvis could've been a Cruiserweight champion and his dad never should've been his trainer.

 

TREMENDOUS POTENTIAL.

He has some good wins, including, I think, Bonecrusher Smith. But he was a natural cruiserwight, and a fine boxer. His dad turned him into a heavyweight swarmer.

They should have let him win a cruiserweight belt, and then let him grow into a heavy.

POST SCRIPT: Bonecrusher, Ribalta, Tillis, Broad, and Bugner. He could have been a hell of a fighter.

 

He had potential as a cruiser.

He did not have his dad's left hook. Sorry but in the post 70's era, if you are a small guy, you need a strong punch to compete.

Compare Usyk or Holyfield to Marvis. Usyk and Holyfield hit like George Foreman compared to Marvis.

Marvis was an ok puncher for cruiserweight and a good boxer. His dad tried to turn him into an attacking version of himself. Bad idea. A small heavyweight with good but not exceptional boxing skills and average at best power isn't going to set the world alight at heavyweight.

Marvis shouldn't have been matched with Holmes so early although i can understand matching him for the payday.

Matching him with Tyson was outright criminal.

Good guy and a good boxer who should have competed seriously at cruiser and then moved up to heavy and slowly worked himself up.

 

Great potential if he’d gotten away from his daddy who knew only one template for fighting and tried to create Marvis in that image, but of course that wasn’t going to happen since Marvis worshipped his daddy.

 

I don’t know If he had the makings of an ATG like his father. But yes I think he could have gone further than he actually did. As already mentioned he might have been a great cruiserweight champion or even a bit better at heavyweight. The two biggest problems I see are :

1. His father tried to push a style on him that didn’t work for him.

2. He was moved along too quickly

 

Marvis had a fine amateur pedigree.

Won a world junior championship. Went 44-0 before losing to Tony Tubbs, himself an outstanding world-class amateur.

Frazier beat Tim Witherspoon, David Bey and Mitch Green in the amateurs.

But he also lost his final amateur fight, in the Olympic Trials, when James Broad iced him in like 16 seconds. That probably told us what the tale was going to be when he started facing heavier-hitting big boys in the pros.

Agree he should have campaigned at cruiser — not that he didn’t beat some good heavies, Tyson and Holmes aside (I don’t know about anyone else but when I heard he was fighting Tyson after being exposed by Holmes, I predicted a KO 1 result … and not in Marvis’ favor).

And his natural style was a slick in-and-out boxer with really good hand speed and combos. He should have fought more like Floyd Patterson and less like his dad.

 

Yes, and we saw it.

 

He was actually pretty good, an effective boxer. He could have had a good CW run and perhaps a belt in those early days. Bigger money was at HW at the time though, so he fought in a division he was small for, and sadly attempted to fight in his fathers style at his urging and he was ill suited to it.
He had some decent wins and clearly was talented but he belonged at CW.
Putting him in with Tyson was only going to end in one way.

 

He was “something” perhaps he just lacked the very rare desire his dad had.
Marvis did a helluva lot more than we did for this thing we all claim to love - but we here (mostly) merely observe.
I’m always saying this but not everyone gets to be Joe Louis - what is fulfilling your potential anyway?
Joe Louis could’ve always trained 1 minute longer, ran another 100ms, threw one more punch.
Only the results as they are, not ought to be, anything else is impossible to say and perhaps without answer.

 

This.

 

Do not think so.

If his name was Henry Jenkins or something and boxed out of Columbus Ohio or some other Non-boxing area---how does that work out for him? He was a massive beneficiary of that pedigree and and Philly background. Insert a Salt Lake City or some other ciy and then consider the opportunities-----Be a much much tougher road.

And I do not think he handles a tougher road.

 

Again, getting away from that pedigree and background would have been the best thing for Marvis.

 

I think that he had just about as much potential as any other man if given the same opportunities. I think that Marvis had lots of chances to do good for himself but he never really carved out something decent for a legacy.
On paper, he only has two losses, but his wins over good competition are EXTREMELY questionable. Tillis was robbed out of a stoppage win over him, Smith was arguably robbed in their decision, and that leaves his only non questionable wins to be against Bugner and Broad... Not exactly top wins.
I think it's a showing of people's knowledge about the 80's heavyweight scene that Frazier gets more recognition than other guys simply because he had more opportunities to fight decent boxers, and got plenty of robberies cause of who his Dad was.
A rose by any other name wouldn't smell as sweet.

 

he had a strong amateur record and beat some notable amateurs. I know that not all amateurs become top pros but he did show genuine potential with a different style in the amateurs.