Rocky Marciano hit harder than Sonny Liston

No worries mate,I fully agree that the Rock was as tough as hell and could well match Sonny
in pure punching power.All your comments are perfectly sensible.
My reponse to this Rocky Jim character was particularly aggressive because this clown always
slags off Liston no matter what subject is being discussed.
Good thread.You presented your opinions really well.

 

Nope I admire Marciano ,he was a great fighter and champ.
I just don't have any time for fanboy Rockistas who think he was the greatest thing since sliced bread ,and could give away 30 /50 lbs of muscle to modern sized class heavyweights.

I admire Marciano and what he accomplished with his limited stature and talent.He was a great fighter and a great champion.
I do not admire his rabid, Rockista fanboys,who believe he was the greatest thing since sliced bread,and that he could compete on even terms with class men 30/ 50lbs heavier who can hit like a truck.
Williams was 20 years old and 10lbs below his mature fighting weight he was also a late sub.
Liston, the number one contender for the crown, was equally unimpressed with second-rated Eddie. "All Machen wanted to do was go 12 rounds," he said. "He didn't want to fight. I had a bad night." Liston, who at 211 had a 15-pound weight advantage over Machen, went on to say that Patterson "wouldn't last that long with me. He would get in there and fight and I'd get him out."

 

One punch KO I think Marciano punches harder, while Liston had heavier hands.

P4p Marciano no question.

 

Bringing up testimonials from guys in Marcianos era is missing the point entirely. Marciano probably was the hardest puncher those guys faced they fought in the same smaller era as Marciano. Charles fought old Louis and Elmer Ray and thats the groups collective experince against other HW big hitters. Thats not proving anything. They didn't face prime Louis, Baer Bros, Ingo, Liston or Cleveland Williams.

Wepner got a title shot because he won a version of the North American title by beating Ernie Terrell. With NABF champ Ali holding the world belt this made Wepner the only American regional champ at the time he fought Ali. 5 of Wepners 9 losses were to Foreman, Liston, Bugner, Roman and Buster Mathis. A lot of the more questionable title shots are regional champions.

Your right about Cleveland Williams resume as a fighter but his inability to win the big fight isn't an indictment on his power versus Marcianos.

Also I'm not a Walcott guy I think Machen and Folley would handle him most days and Patterson certainly would. Walcott was 2-7 in title fights. And is in the club with Axel Schulz for losing 3 title fights in a row.

 

I knew Ron Lyle. We lived in the same city and I sat in the living room with him in an apartment where he was temporarily staying and together we watched the Lyle-Ali and Lyle-Foreman fights. He told me Ali was a good puncher.

 

Williams wasn't 6 years into his career. He boxed a handful of 4-rounders in 1949 (actually 5 years before the Satterfield fight) before being forced to quit because he was underage. He'd been an active professional for just two and a half years when he fought Satterfield.

The trouble with comparing him to fighters like Jerry Quarry and Ingemar Johansson is they learned the fundamentals of the sport during long amateur careers. Williams had no amateur career at all.

And of course, arguing about his level of experience won't change the fact that he was a 20 year old kid who was called in to face Satterfield on just 2 days' notice.

 

1. Rocky hit very hard.

2. To the people totally dismissing him, you're trying too hard.

3. To his acolytes and those who worship at his shrine, I'll offer my standard line about Marciano. I absolutely respect and honor what he did in his time and place against the people he had in front of him, that's why I rank him No. 5 on my ATG heavyweight list. I also think at least 15, maybe a few more, of the other ATGs would have crushed him in actual head-to-head competition, including Liston. But he'd have died trying and he would have gotten Liston's attention with his punches.

 

Marciano is one of the hardest hitting Heavyweights at around his weightclass 185-200 pounds.

But at 200+ pounds there's plenty of harder hitting Heavyweights.

Zhang
Joshua
Wladimir
Lewis
Foreman
Tyson
Shavers
Tua
Bruno
Ruddock

Etc.

Marciano had alot of stamina and could consistently punch hard which was his best asset. But there has been plenty of bigger Heavyweights with better single punch power. And whilst Marciano deserves respect you're being very nostalgic if you think 185 pound 67 inch reach Heavyweight is going to be able to be succeasful being ultra aggressive against Heavyweights 40/50 pounds heavier with on average 10 inch reach advantage.

 

Joshua v Dubois very bloated?
Usyk,Parker, Sanchez,Hrgovic,Wilder, Joyce.Bloated?
I don't have to take anyone's word I watched Liston v Machen on TV when it happened.
I started buying fight films in the middle 1960's.
Yes Williams was not in peak form do you dispute this?
Williams was a 20 years old late substitute, and no amount of spin by you is going to change that.
210lbs is not185lbs.
Chisora and Mathis were not Liston.
Chisora was a poor man's Frazier.
Mathis was a decent boxer without real power.

Prime Jerry Quarry v Prime Liston. Who wins?

 

You are wasting your time against these Rockista's.