Boxercise Ben

Just looks as though you,ve got a problem with ben davidson as a man tbh. I get it hes arrogant and annoying. But joshua fought with loose hands before davidson. At one point in his career they had him fighting with a high guard but his transition on the offence was too slow and too predictable and his foot speed going backwards is too slow for it. Dubois would have punched through his guard. It would have also gave joshua less chance on offense to try and stop dubois from doing it.

Its not that these guys are clueless....its just that they know the stuff we,re telling them wont work because they,ve tried it a lot of the time.

If i remember right he fought with a high guard against helenius and possibly franklin. Both painful to watch. If either we,re any good they,d have beat joshua.

Helenius still jabbed his head off with that high guard. Dubois would have punched right through it. By keeping his hands lower it gives him a chance to keep the opponent off with a quicker offense. Hes too telegraphed with his hands from a high guard....it would have just ended with him shelling up while dubois unloaded on him.

It didnt work but neither would have the high guard....they knew that because they tried it against lesser opponents.

 

Joshuas biggest mistake was the ruiz 2 fight. I still say that was his worst night by running away against ruiz.

It was at that point the first ruiz defeat he should have went to a coach that could teach him and train him how to actually fight. Not box but fight. Don charles would have actually helped him. Dons not really a technical guy but hes just put a fighter out there prepared for battle....whereas the other ones trying to win fights technically without having the tools to carry it out.

They should have stopped telling joshua about how to box and got him in there with the body belt.....and tough hard spars. Too much knowledge and not enough getting him battle hardened. Was never going to be technical enough to avoid a fight.

 

Your armchair analysis that keeping your hands up will get Joshua hit just as much as he did keeping his hands at his chest and waist (which was a helluva lot, he couldn't possibly get hit more than that) is your own personal opinion and I would thank you to not pass it off like you're stating a fact. I am of the opinion that simply keeping his left hand up would have probably prevented the first knockdown in which Dubois threw a right hand from outer space and took months if not years to finally connect on Joshua's chin. Instead pulling straight back with your left hand down is a better idea according to yourself and Ben Davison.

 

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If joshua goes round with his hands up.....he has nothing to keep an opponent like dubois off him because his transition from high guard to offense is too slow and too telegraphed.

The reason the hands are down was to discourage dubois from coming forward like he ended up doing by having an offence set up that could catch him coming in.

Joshua was still too slow. But it wouldnt really have mattered anyway. Joshua would have either been high guard and would have shelled up with dubois punching through the guard or what ended up happening.

Dubois hands we,rent all that high either for that same reason. They we,re higher than joshua,s.....but hes faster on the transition than joshua is. They tried high guard tho and it ended with helenius hitting him all night. A much slower older fighter than dubois.

If it was as simple as telling your boxer to keep the hands up and chin down...we,d all be boxing trainers. I think davidson should have been telling him to keep the hands up after that first round.....but there is a bigger reason joshua isnt fighting out of a high guard etc and getting them hands up after the first round would have probably just ended the same way....with dubois punching through joshuas guard without joshua having anything to keep him off with.

 

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I have never heard anyone ever claim before that having your hands up means you can't keep someone off you. Plenty of boxers that don't box with their hands as low as AJ's were to disprove that claim. It sounds like you're saying he shouldn't have even attempted to block punches as blocking punches is actually just a useless tactic. If thats your theory and you want to stick with that then suit yourself but whats not a theory and is a fact is that Davison's hands low chin up strategy for AJ was not working at all. He needed to do something, actually anything, other than what Davison had him doing.

 

His rubbish boxing was not 'a strategy' from his coach. That's just a coping mechanism and an excuse that you always get after a Joshua defeat. You can't just say he was poor, there has to be an external reason for it. He's either the god of boxing or a novice learning on the job - make your mind up. A former 2x world champion, Olympic gold medallist and someone who has been in gyms for 16 years now knows better than to go back and forward in straight lines, chin up, guard down. He either lost his composure from the onslaught or he's just not that good anymore. It's not because his trainer (who apparently was the second coming before the fight that had got him back to his best) told him to fight like a lemon.

 

Thats the same guy that got chisora to follow fury round the ring in straight lines as fury jabbed his head off.

Which kind of backs up my point. A lot of the time the coaches are working within the limitations of the fighter. Or the superiority of the opponents style against your one. Turned out dubois was faster....more accurate. More fluid and stronger etc than joshua.

Putting his hands up and boxing from a high guard wouldnt have stopped what was coming. Joshuas fought like that on numerous occasions and he struggled with it against inferior opponents.

 

Manny Steward had Klitchsko a style that brought great success with probably a worse chin than AJ. I haven't the pleasure of even seeing AJ in a gym, I assume he can't punch while moving as he seems to either be running on back foot or piling forward. I've said to a few of mine that on tv coach can give greatest advice in world to get praised BUT if you haven't shown them in gym how to do it, or you know they can't its worse than useless. If capable in the 5th youd ideally have told AJ to double up the jab whilst edging out not into danger, spoil up close and get through to round 7 see if can clear the head, if Dubois falls short fire a bomb if not play safe, I assume those that have worked with him don't deem him capable of doing that.

 

My opinion is that he was never that good in the first place and will always be exposed fighting any live opponent.

He has only faced 2 live opponents where there was some doubt about outcome pre fight being Usyk and Dubois but somehow also got battered all over New York by a small obese Andy Ruiz.

He has yet to face an opponent in the ring where he is the underdog when the first bell sounded.

Decent fighter but no better than Danny Williams or Herbie Hide in previous eras. The only difference is Eddie Hearn made him a fortune with his spin, lies and very soft matchmaking until he stepped in with Usyk.

 

https://www.reddit.com/r/Boxing/s/IUHtRdg2qq

McGuigan called out the bad advice from Ben and even said he will walk onto a short right hand. Hilarious how out of his depth Boxercise Ben is.

 

What was his alternative tho. Its allright saying what not to do but its pretty useless without telling him what to do.

Pretty sure mcguigan would have had him trying to survive......tbh tho thats what he,d been doing from that 1st round knockdown. Dubois would have most likely just punched through it.

Joshua had been down four times....one more and it was over. At some point when you,ve got a guy that can punch....but is slower than the opponent and getting outpunched all over the place you pretty much need to roll that dice.

I think a lot of these people have a good point.....that advise ben gave isnt really sound advice 99 percent of the time. But when you,ve been bumped over 4 times and your on the verge of getting stopped outfought...outpunched...outsped and your careers on the verge of falling apart it probably is time to roll the dice.

 

'Boxercise Ben' might be rubbish or not, but we can't really blame the cornerman/coach for AJ's shortcomings at this level and stage of his career.
The last two fights a whole bunch of you were probably saying Ben was doing "a great job" with AJ.

The problem isn't the trainer.
AJ can't deal with a fighter like Dubois fighting like that. Can't deal with someone young and stronger than him, can't deal with a young puncher like that, with some skills and a chin and coming off some form. AJ falls to pieces when hit, gasses out under pressure and falls around the ring grinning with a sheepish grin on his face. This is nothing new. This is Anthony Joshua. He's fine against the Wallins and old Pulevs and Helenius. But put him in with someone who can punch and take a punch, the best you can hope for is a Parker/Franklin/Ruiz 2 type win.