Jack Johnson vs. James J. Jeffries, Primes

Prime Johnson by knockout, probably very early.

 

Close to a 50/50 fight honestly. Depends how much stronger and more durable a prime Jeffries was compared to the Jeffries that Jack actually fought. I’m not sure how Johnson’s power compares to Sharkey, Fitz, Munroe (who Sharkey called the hardest hitter he faced), Ruhlin, Choynski. Sure, Johnson was bigger than most of them but that doesn’t automatically translate to being more powerful as we know. I think Jeffries was likely much more accurate with his shots than the other 200 lb punchers Johnson’s faced like McVea, so a good question to ask is if Johnson can take that leather for long.

Johnson himself was very physically strong, especially the 1910 version, I’m not sure if he’s on the level of peak Jeffries in this regard as Jeffries was bigger but it’s certainly possible they had equatable physical strength.

Gun to my head, I’d say Jeffries gets him out of there eventually

 

Johnson always wins imo.A prime fight maybe goes the distance.

 

Hard to gauge really. Jeffries was 6 years out of the ring and hadn’t had any warm up fights nor did he keep himself in shape during his long layoff before meeting Johnson.

Johnson won comfortably but even he’d have conceded that that wasn’t the genuine Jeffries in with him that day (in face I recall reading that Johnson ranked Jeffries as the best heavyweight of all time before his death, whether that’s true or not).

I’ll hedge my bets and tip a very hard fought draw prime for prime.

 

Agreed, except I'd guess, without any confidence, Johnson close points decision win.

 

Jeffries was very well prepared to their actual fight.... wasn´t old, had a short career so not worn out, not really... I don´t see why it would be any different. Ring rusty gets overrated, it exists but it´s not too much of a problem when your body is still fresh and you are well trained.

 

Hi Vic.
Interesting take on the Johnson/Jeffries build up and fight, couple of your observations I am not fully on board with, Jeffries was six years out of the ring, not 2 or 3 , so I would imagine that would blunt your performance somewhat, added to that, he had ballooned to 300lbs or 21.5 stone, so it must have taken its toll to lose around 6 stone in the months leading up to the fight, and he was approaching 35, plus he had shipped a lot of punishment due to his walk forward style of fighting, so I think there would be a huge difference had they fought in their respective primes, just my opinion Vic, like your post and your input on the forum.
stay safe buddy, chat soon.

 

Hi, Mike, I have some controversial opinions, I guess the chances are bigger for you being totally right.
For once, I don´t necessarily believe in ring rust, unless it means out of shape and no trainning regime...

Considering the number of rounds Jeffries fought in his life, I can´t see much damage being taken... but hey, I never watched those fights, they were brutal it seems.

What can make me change my take would be this weight aspect, having to lose it quickly... that could be a big disavantage.

 

I couldn't disagree with this any more strongly.

People rightfully take Ali's 3 year absence into account, when after 2 comeback fights aged 29, Frazier beat him. Ali looks to have kept in reasonable shape during his hiatus and of course always aimed to return to the ring.

Jeffries was retired for 6 years and returned at 35 straight into the Johnson fight, no tune ups. 35 was ancient for the time and equivalent to 40+ today. He was retired with no intention to return and ballooned to an obese 300lbs.

Gun to my head and I'd pick Johnson over Jeffries peak for peak. I rank Johnson higher than Jeffries all time. But their actual fight is completely meaningless. Jeffries was further removed from his prime, than Ali was his vs Holmes. Shot doesn't begin to cover it.

 

I suspect you & I would clean up in betting on this. Very few pick Jeffries as he’s not the, “feel-good” choice I suppose, but he is more than a match for the at-times over-rated Johnson. Could swing either way but I suspect Jeffries will carry the day.

 

Case in point.

 

In short. Yep.

 

But you didn´t explain why you disagree. Tune up fights could help, mentally speaking, because in sparring you don´t have crowds... but physically it can go both ways.... how many times Jeffries was injured during that 6 years of resting ? I´m 100% sure Johnson had some pain somwhere in his body for being active...
35 was ancient for the time, of course... but I was only talking about ring rust and how I don´t buy too much all the weight generally is put into it.
If the trainning camp is good, and you sparred good guys, the only problem could be the emotional aspect of a official fight, but that will vary from person to person. Some guys experienced enough will not feel that..

 

With respect, I did explain why i disagree.

No boxer is the same first fight back after a 6 year retirement. Again, with respect, that's just common sense and self evident.

That's before you consider 35 is ancient for the time and Jeffries ate himself to over 300lbs. He wasn't sparring, or even ticking over in the gym for 6 years with half an eye on a return to the ring, he was retired and living the good life for the vast majority of these 6-years.

As I said, shot doesn't even begin to cover it.