How is Usyk better than Canelo P4P?

That's a fair point, although I've become a firm believer in recent years that past a certain weight anyone can compete with anyone else. Guys who are a legit 210-215 have the ability to punch as hard as any HW (hell, Wilder is more or less around this weight already), whereas this isn't the case the lower down the weight scale you go. Inoue's a phenomenal puncher, but I doubt he'd make a dent on someone like Josh Taylor, whereas a guy like Marco Huck could definitely KO a guy like Fury if he landed cleanly on him (not that he would, of course).

 

The eye test alone can never be a satisfactory way of rating a fighter or a division for two reasons. One, it's highly prone to subjectivism, and two it's dependent on competition which can hugely influence how impressive a fighter looks. For example, I think Gassiev looked like an extremely good fighter when beating Dorticos last year, but a number of posters seemed to think he looked static and limited (the subjective element). Then there's his opponent, Dorticos. I've followed Dorticos for a while and think he's also a very good fighter, a little sloppy at times, but a genuine talent. But again a number of posters thought Dorticos was a bum-beater with an inflated KO record, so Gassiev's win over him wasn't impressive in their eyes.

Now maybe both fighters get smashed at HW and prove me wrong. Or maybe they go on to be real threats like Hunter. That's neither here nor there. But as of right now it's just not enough evidence to form a good opinion of a fighter's talent level until it's married to results against proven fighters, preferably at different weight classes.

 

correct me if im wrong, but hunter has never won a world title, do you know how many there are just like him in every division?

nobody said that was the case, i dont know why youre debating that.

 

No, he hasn't won a title, but he's not been in the division that long nor is he the type of marketable fighter that's ever going to get fast tracked to a title shot. However, he just drew with a former belt holder and current top ten fighter in Povetkin and that puts him in pretty rarified company, no?

I was highlighting it more than accusing you of doing it. A lot of fans like to anoint fighters based on how impressively they beat sub-par competition or denigrate fighters for not looking amazing against similarly talented opponents. Until more CWs start moving up and having success the strength or weakness of the division has to remain to some degree a question mark.

 

No

 

Who has Usky beaten? A bunch of little known Russian

 

Lol learn who beat before saying something so thick

 

It's impossible for anyone to be better than Canelo.

 

Go watch the Bivol fight. Let alone the first two GGG ones.

 

Obviously Usyk is greater than Canelo.

If you want to argue Canelo is more talented offensively, i would agree. Canelo throws every punch in the book with authority - left hook to head and body, right and left uppercuts with authority, straight right, combinations, counters, body and head shots.

Usyk has some terrific offense too but Canelo has more of it.

On the other hand, Usyk has convincingly beaten better fighters - he has beaten Bredis, Joshua x 2, Fury, Gassiev, and Hunter. Canelo has had far too many controversial fights including the gift draw vs GGG. Canelo has tried to age certain fighters out (see GGG) while Usyk fought anyone anytime anywhere.

 

That isn't obvious at all. Canelo is a four division champion and three division lineal (I think). He has a deeper resume overall. GGG, Jacobs, Lara, Plant, Kovalev, Trout, Cotto, Smith, Charlo, Munguia and Sanders is better than what Usyk has.

 

Are you trolling?

 

If they both retired today, they’d be close on ATG lists. If Usyk loses clearly to Fury, Canelo will place ahead on any reasonable list.

 

No they wouldn't mate.

Usyk completely unified CW, as the away fight and B side every single time.

He then moved up to HW and completely unified that division also, again as the the away fighter and B side every single time. He's got victories over 3 of the top 4 at HW right now.

Canelo lost to Floyd, Golvokin and Bivol. There's no way any reasonable person ranks him above Usyk.

Whilst Canelo fights the likes of Berlanga, Usyk is fighting Tyson Fury.

 

Canelo didn’t lose to GGG.

You’re talking about home field advantage as if it’s a soccer game and talking about cruiserweight as if it matters as much as the divisions Canelo has competed in. Yeah, Breidis was solid but I’m not so sure about the others at cruiser.

Canelo has been fighting on the big stage for at least his last 25 fights. That’s more fights than Usyk’s had as a pro.