Do you think Ngannou's performance against Fury is overrated?

I don't think there is anyone else he has fought as technically good as Usyk, so can't see a comparison to anyone there technically, but I felt Fury only won 3 of the first 6 rounds.
I agree he did look good in the three rounds I felt he won (4,5,6)
I think he looked better in the first 6 rounds of his first two fights against Wilder.
Usyk is alot smaller than Fury so I didn't see it as any real surprise that Fury would have his moments as Fury uses his size effectively. I doubt he would look as good if Usyk was 6ft 7 or so and naturally heavier
I think Fury slipping Wilders shots in the first 6 rounds of their first fight and arguably winning 5 of the first 6 rounds, that he looked better

 

I haven't rescored it but I had Fury 6-0 or 5-1 live. Thought he was well in control of the fight.

He will always look better against lesser opposition but if I make a formula that tabulates how good someone looks, taking into account how good the opponent is, the first 6 rounds against Usyk are better than any 6 round stretch he ever had in his career up to that point.

 

That’s it. Conditioned or not, Fury would never gain advantage utilising his highly preferred clinch and smother tactic against Ngannou. He was very much negated in that department.

 

Mods deleted my counters to their Fury damage control, literally 1984 here

 

No. If not for unscored knockdown he would have became lineal HW champ as a debutant.

The thing with Ngannou that isn't appreciated is how unique a threat someone 6 ft 4 with power bulking up to 272 is. Guys that heavy tend to either be giants or the short fat types.

I also don't think it was appreciated how boxing centric HW in MMA is compared to the rest of the sport. While HW MMA has its wrestlers your typical HW fight in the UFC is two guys who hit really hard trying to knock the other out quickly. And this is a far better base for boxing than the smaller MMA strikers have.

 

I scored 4,5,6 for Fury
1,2,3 for Usyk.

including Wallin?
Or Wilder 3? Or Ngannou even.
We are talking the first 6 rounds only here I assume still?

If you tabulate a formula, you can make it any way you choose to suit yourself
I doubt it would be 100% factual and more based on how you see it as I wouldn't expect the majority of people to see the first 6 rounds of Fury / Usyk to have all been for Fury. Of course I am speculating now and basing that on what I think, though wouldn't try and say I have a formula for this or that I would be bothered to make one.

As I said before, size does play a part.
I think Floyd Mayweather is exceptionally skilled and talented but wouldn't imagine him looking great against Fury due to size and you could say Fury looked good against the most skilled opponent if you know what I mean.

Do you think Fury would have looked as good against Usyk in the first 6 rounds if Usyk was 6ft 7 and naturally a stone and a half heavier but otherwise the same fighter?
I think Fury had problems with Ngannou as Francis was as naturally strong and heavier where he wouldn't have as physical a fight with Usyk as Usyk wouldn't have as much strength or weight to apply, and that has nothing to do with skill on that example

 

I think Usyk is the best fighter Fury has ever fought, all things considered.

I think Fury looked mint in the first 6 rounds of the fight against Usyk.

I don't think Fury has ever looked as good, against someone as good, as he did then.

 

So do I

ok

If you feel he was Fury's best opponent, you won't have anyone to compare him to, who you feel is as good. That's why my first question was
highest level you have seen him box or highest level based on the opponent?
There is a difference.

You said

I also asked and commented

 

I know what you asked, I gave my response. All things considered he never looked as good imo.

 

What does overrated even mean in this context? No one expected Ngannou to do anything but be utterly embarrassed and perhaps stopped early. Instead he knocked the champion down two times and completely manhandled him to the point where one of the neutral judges awarded him the win. There's no way you can spin that in a positive light for Fury. He ****ed up and shouldn't have let a fighter of Ngannou's inexperience make it remotely close, and the fact he did (and gave people an argument for thinking Ngannou was robbed of the win) is fully on his own head.

 

You know what is interesting is in the old days I think pre Joe Louis fighters grappled as part of their preparation something like 1-2 hrs a day....I am not sure if any train it today. Part of the reason I think big heavyweights today would have trouble with the physical strength of fighters from those eras lb for lb they were stronger and fitter athletes like big Frank but real boxers

 

"Overrated", in this context, I suppose, means did the performance flatter to deceive?

Your post reads like there is an argument for this being the case, in so far as Fury's poor approach to this bout, for whatever reason that might have been, allowed Ngannou to make a fight of it.

It's not the first time Fury has made a meal out of beating an opponent - to his detriment - and we later see Ngannou put into a different perspective in his next fight against Joshua.

With this in mind, I'd say the performance is overrated and agree to a fair extent that it was almost entirely down to Fury for this being the case.

 

I think it is because Fury and idiot trainer basically admitted they didn't take it seriously.
That means if they had it would have almost certainly been quite different.
Fury would have been more careful and probably boxed to a UD comfortably.

People praise AJ but he and team had the advantage of understanding the threat and preparing more properly. As an egomaniac himself, he could easily have gone in and got dropped and put in trouble if he hadn't seen Fury get into trouble. Difference is he wouldn't have recovered.

However it was a dumb fight, unbelievably dumb management and even a prepared Fury could get clipped, especially because his stopping power isn't great so the opponent would hang around longer than with AJ most likely.

I'm not surprised the mma fighter did well against a Fury who was way too overconfident and didn't prepare. I considered it a risky fight because I'd seen the opponent against good mma boxers and knew he was dangerous to take lightly. That's exactly what Fury and his trainer did so it's no surprise that the fight turned into disaster for them.

Having said that, I'm not a world-class trainer, so criticising a world-class trainer and a world-class team from behind a keyboard is pretty ridiculous. They are professionals and know more than any observer ever could. True, they couldn't work out that a veteran MMA striker 250lbs with a huge KO record who'd never been stopped might be worth preparing seriously for when their entire legacy was on the line. But apart from that, they've got it all worked out.

 

a MMA fighter in his boxing debut took it to the cards against the #1 (or 2) HW boxer while also getting a knockdown. Its a high achievement for sure.

Fury still won though. I can't see the argument for Francis. I can't remember the scoring but I had it pretty high for Fury even counting the Down.

 

No it definitely wasn't overrated, because Ngannou shouldn't have even been able to touch Fury at all, and this was his first professional fight................Fury definitely won the fight, there's really no question but Ngannou made him and boxing look bad.

And dropping the actual world HW champion......Thank God Joshua put him to bed