If shot Fury beats peak Usyk, where does he rank?

Not in a good way. A lot of heavies are badly out of shape and carrying excess lard. Some of them could easily make cruiserweight were they so inclined.
Wilder could easily make cruiserweight and he's considered one of Fury's better wins.

Also Lerena appeared of shape at heavyweight. I should think that would slow him down and make him less effective relative to his cruiserweight self.

 

Names, please? What fights were on the table that he ducked?

 

Lerena still lost. Cruiserweights don't typically transfer well into heavyweight outside a couple of exceptions.

 

I'm not picking holes in your post here or disputing it per se, but Usyk has won 4 Hw fights against top 10 rated HWs (3 different opponents), Fury has won 4 HW fights against top 10 rated HWs (3 different opponents)
Which learning and filler type fights do you feel make the massive difference in HW standing between the 2?

 

This is not peak Usyk, and he is fighting way over his best weight. Have to see how the fight pans out before deciding its historic significance.

 

So if Ali, Holmes and Foreman were brought forward in a time machine and Fury beat them all those wins don't do anything for him because he's so much bigger, like he is over Usyk? Mind boggling. The division is UNLIMITED regarding weight, it's not P4****ingP.

 

There's a varied collection of attempts to handicap the credibility of Fury's wins, both past and future, it would seem. The one you have just now addressed is perhaps the most obviously bizarre.

 

Any tbh. Styles make fights and Usyk hasn't faced as much variety as he could imo. It will affect his legacy at heavyweight overall.

 

He isn't shot he is moody

 

Hard to argue. Some peeps can't get raise themselves past personality and personal dislike. It's bizarre.

 

I agree with the principle of what you are saying here, but was asking what major difference you feel Fury has done
I pointed out to you that Usyk has won 4 Hw fights against top 10 rated HWs (3 different opponents), Fury has won 4 HW fights against top 10 rated HWs (3 different opponents).
Fury has been a HW his entire career and had noticeably more fights than Usyk, but in fighting different top 10 rated opponents at HW were quite similar.
Remember on another thread conversation we had, I wrote that it had to be taken into account that the more top opposition faced the more chance of losing
So going back to the original question Which learning and filler type fights do you feel make the massive difference in HW standing between the 2?
I can't see why you would say "any" as I can't really envisage Usyk losing to any of the on the way up journeyman type fighters Fury would have faced whilst learning his trade. It was why I was wondering if you had any particular fighters and why you wouldn't look at their whole careers?
Would you not give Usyk credit for beating Hunter as they were both lighter at the time to what they are today?

 

Fury would have more top ten opponents and wins wouldn't he? I'm not 100% on this, but Wlad, Whyte, Wilder and Chisora were all top ten at some stage when he fought them.

Also worth remembering that many criticize Fury for his lack of top ten names on his resume, so not sure how comparing Usyk to him helps your argument.

Additionally, why would Usyk get credit at Heavyweight for a fight he had at Cruiserweight? They're different divisions.

The simple fact of the matter is that Usyk won't rank as high as an ATG without more fights (even if many think he deserves to).

 

How would one do so in the first place? Wilder has a very poor resume and his reputation is largely based on his losing efforts with Fury I'm not sure how one would evaluate the worth of that win. Wlad was 39, looked poor in his prior fight and never won another fight getting kayoed by Joshua and then retiring.

How much credit does he get for those wins given the circumstances?

 

Well by that logic what credit does Usyk get for any of his heavyweight fights?

Sounds a bit silly doesn't it.