(PRIME) Oleksandr Usyk vs. (PRIME) Joe Frazier

I have noticed Usyk sometimes takes a minute, or even a round off, and my assumption is this is so he can process the data rather than physically recover. He did so against Fury fight one and AJ fight two and came back mentally refreshed with a plan, winning both fights. He won't be able to do this against Joe. There is no time or space, physical or mental to do this.

 

Close fight
Probably give the edge to frazier, especially with modern "supplements"

 

I see this fight similar to the Ali v Frazier fights. The big difference though is Ali was vulnerable to the left hook whereas Usyk is more vulnerable to the uppercut. Due to this fact I have to give the edge to Usyk but I could still see Frazier getting a late knockout.

 

The only pressure fighter who gave Usyk real problems was Chisora, who outweighed him by close to 40 pounds and used that size advantage to bully him in the early rounds. (Briedis primarily found success boxing off the backfoot and countering.) Even in the Chisora fight, Usyk clearly won most rounds, so the narrative about how "difficult" that fight was is exaggerated.

Against Gassiev, another pressure fighter, Usyk completely outboxed him without significant issues.

Joe Frazier, being much smaller than Usyk, slower, and lacking a dangerous right hand, wouldn't replicate Chisora's limited success. Unlike Ali, Usyk wouldn't sit on the ropes allowing Frazier to work him over. Instead, he would maintain distance, use his movement, and punish Frazier whenever he tried to close in. Crucially, Usyk isn't vulnerable to the left hook—Frazier's signature weapon that helped him defeat Ali in their first bout.

Furthermore, Frazier likely lacks the power to truly threaten Usyk, who has shown he can hurt super heavyweights. While Frazier had a good chin, it wasn't exceptional, and Usyk possesses more than enough power to keep him honest and potentially hurt him.

The outcome? Usyk wins either by clear decision or late stoppage.

 

Not that Compubox is the be-all and end-all of anything, but since Chisora is being put forward as the closest proxy for Frazier...it's interesting that despite being 40 pounds heavier than Frazier, Chisora threw about the same number of punches over 12 rounds against Usyk as Frazier did over 15 in the Fight of the Century against Ali.

This content is protected

This content is protected

...So I don't think Frazier will overwhelm Usyk on sheer volume.

 

Chisora could throw a lot of punches. Even against Joyce just 2 fights ago or so.

 

Gassiev got schooled by Wallin dude he's not a good analog. Chisora isn't a body puncher, i always saw Frazier as superior in every department besides size

 

Implying that Gassiev that got schooled by Wallin is the same one Usyk fought physically he was shot after dealing with numerous injuries
Chisora hits way harder and its his size that allowed him to have success against Usyk not his style.

 

Gassiev always had cement feet, Frazier doesn't. He's a boxer puncher more than a relentless pressure fighter. Chisora is also slower, doesn't counter punch as frequent and telegraph his shots. I disagree, it's the style. It's exactly why aj gave Usyk a harder fight in the rematch with his more aggressive and he still gassed. I hate to say it but aj won plenty of rounds in there

 

I think the biggest difference though is that Frazier consistently keeps hitting very hard even deep into fights.

Chisora normally fades in the 2nd half of the fight where as Frazier is known to get stronger as the fight goes on and as I said he's still consistently punching very hard over 15 rounds.

Whilst Frazier's output may not overwhelm Usyk his consistent pressure and consistent hard punches throughout an entire duration of a fight will give Usyk immense problems.

I see Frazier, Tyson, as bad style match ups for Usyk ATG swarmers who Usyk can't keep off him will be a major problem especially since both men are very good body punchers also.

 

Gassiev is not even remotely in the same ball park as a prime Frazier regarding being a H2H threat at Heavyweight.

Gassiev wouldn't even be in the top 100 in regards to H2H ability at Heavyweight.

 

I'm not so sure. As happens so often, I realize that I might just not understand what I'm looking at, but the 60s-70s guys look just as sapped and tired as many modern guys; more fighting at a jogging pace in later rounds than quick bursts of energy. Frazier was naturally gifted as a cardio monster in his time, but that physical advantage isn't what it used to be anymore, when I suspect lots of the modern pros have chemical assistance to keep up their workrates.

 

The issue is when you're comparing different eras is what scenario do we use ?

Do we give Frazier the modern training and supplements ?

The Cruiserweight division didn't exist in Frazier's time and more than likely he would be competing as a Cruiserweight in the modern era.

So do we have this fantasy match up at Cruiserweight ?

So many different variables.

 

Frazier's footwork isn't significantly better than Gassiev's. While Chisora might be slower, he possesses a much better right hand and hits considerably harder than Frazier. The issue for Usyk against Chisora wasn't speed—it was size and power, attributes Frazier simply doesn't have.

Regarding AJ vs Usyk, being objective, Joshua won 4 rounds at most—5 if you're being generous. And let's be clear: AJ has several advantages over Frazier, primarily size, length and power. The rounds Joshua won came from landing right hands and going to the body after proper setup, not from applying Frazier-style pressure.

The styles are fundamentally different. Joshua found limited success with tactical aggression and superior physical tools that Frazier lacks, not with the crowding, hooking pressure that Frazier used.

 

Usyk isn't particularly vulnerable to a right hand, it's the uppercut. Chisora landed plenty of left hooks on the guard. This idea that left hooks aren't good punches against a southpaw is a total myth. Left hooks are a good punch to get around the guard or suprise them when they're pivoting to your left. Chisora mainly used his size during the clinches which he initiated, the pressure alone still gave him fits to the point he called chisora the hardest puncher he ever fought

The crowding, the body punching and the crouching is precisly what will force Usyk out of his typical comfort. They didn't have those attributes, that's the point. Frazier still probably hits as hard as Briedis who had enough pop to back Usyk up and crowded him on the ropes in spots.

Chisora took breaks, isn't a bodypuncher, fought Usyk in spurts, and has slower feet. These are more things that should be considered on rewatch