Greater/Better fighter: Victor Galindez or Dwight Muhammad Qawi

The last year or so of his initial title run makes for a complicated legacy IMO. On 1 hand, he scored some of his biggest wins during that time frame (Mustafa, Lopez x2) but beginning w/ the Kates rematch, he became increasingly more selective in his output & did just enough to squeak out wins, sometimes very controversially. I thought Lopez was robbed for sure in their 2nd fight.

It wasn't until the Rossman rematch that Galindez regained the fire & form of his earlier title fights, but that would prove to be his last hurrah.

This is probably Galindez's most complete performance that's currently findable on film:

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As much as I admire and respect Victor Emilio and love watching him fight, the series of close (even controversial) decision wins is underscored by the fact that he refused to get into the ring on fight day for a rematch with Mike Rossman because the WBA didn’t get to appoint all the officials (as opposed to the Nevada athletic commission, which had legal and proprietary oversight) … and did so knowing full well that the WBA would make Rossman fight him again on Victor’s/WBA’s terms even though he did not fulfill his contractual obligations as challenger.

It’s one of the most shameful acts of a top fighter I’ve ever seen. He literally refused to walk to the ring, leaving the champion out there not knowing Victor had decided to walk away and fight another way because the CHALLENGER didn’t like the fact that the commission rather than his protective buddies choose the officials — clearly afraid to have his fight officiated by an impartial ref and neutral judges (Rossman was from New Jersey and had no cozy relationship with Nevada officials).

That tells me there’s some complicity among the WBA and Victor and Galindez’s management, and it stinks to high heaven. Stanley Christodoulou and Waldemar Schmidt might as well have worn Galindez corner jackets they were part of officiating his bouts to often.

Then when Rossman retired on his stool after shattering his right hand in the rematch, Victor tried to charge him in the ring (the fight is over) and had to be restrained, then jubilantly declared that he would never fight Rossman again and there would be no rubber match. (Wonder how he knew the WBA wouldn’t make Rossman a mandatory and order one?)

It certainly makes me curious about those close decisions, in many of which Galindez put forth a minimalist effort in many rounds probably with full knowledge that all he had to do was stay on his feet and not get completely outclassed and he would retain. He was, in effect, a WBA house fighter and the challenger would have to overcome not only Victor but the judges and referee to have a chance.

No two ways about it, to me that impacts his legacy and my estimation of him. If you have to have your daddy as ref and your two brothers and a cousin judging to think you can win, you ain’t all that.

That aside, I’d break down the thread topic this way:

1) I’d rate Victor’s legacy at 175 higher than Qawi’s. BUT …

2) Overall, I’d rate Qawi’s legacy across his entire career above Victor’s. If I had to choose between them on a Hall of Fame ballot, Qawi would be the pick without too much thought.

3) H2H at 175, I think Dwight would torture Galindez (Qawi had one hell of a vicious mean streak and delighted in tormenting his prey like he was playing with his food) and run away with a win over 15 rounds. Too good defensively, too sharp a puncher — and given how Victor Emilio liked to lay on the ropes, Qawi puts him through a meat grinder.

4) H2H at cruiser, Qawi stops him. Probably in five rounds or less. Victor’s one fight at cruiser established that he had no future there.

 

It's also been rumored/speculated that the real reason Galindez didn't come out of his dressing room was b/c he wasn't in ideal shape yet & wanted to buy himself more time to prepare.

Regardless, it's never been any secret that Galindez (or at least his management) was "in bed" w/ the WBA just as Don King was in bed w/ the WBC during the 80s. Here's a Sports Illustrated article published shortly after the rematch took place:

"Then came last February's fiasco in Las Vegas, when Galindez pulled out of the rematch at the last minute after the Nevada State Athletic Commission had refused to allow the WBA to import its neutral (read Latin) officials.
But the WBA and Galindez did not have such problems with the Louisiana State Athletic Commission, which imported Christodoulou from Johannesburg, South Africa, Waldemar Schmidt from San Juan, Puerto Rico and Jesus Celis from Caracas, Venezuela. Christodoulou has a history of refereeing Galindez' defenses. In 1976 he allowed Galindez 10 minutes for repair work after Richie Kates cut him badly. Galindez then knocked out Kates in the 15th round. And when Yaqui Lopez fought Galindez in Rome, Christodoulou chose to ignore what Lopez called frequent low blows, butts, rabbit punches and hitting while holding. After 15 rounds, Galindez won by unanimous decision.

"Galindez must like these officials," Rossman had said in disgust a few days before the fight. "I haven't heard him say a word. If the Latins can reach in and steal the title from an American fighter right here in America, then there isn't any justice."
While Rossman's people feared a possible heist if the fight went 15 rounds, they were even more fearful that Galindez would be cut—and that Christodoulou would rule that it had been caused by a butt. If the fight was stopped on a cut, Rossman might lose the title by disqualification."

"In his dressing room, the jubilant Galindez was telling the world that he would never fight Rossman again. "He chickened up" Galindez shouted. "He's a chicken. I'll never give him a rematch."
It was pointed out that Rossman had given him a return. "I got a rematch because I deserved it," Galindez said. "I won't give him one, because he doesn't deserve it."

That creates an interesting situation. After Galindez had been stopped on cuts last September, the Latin-oriented WBA immediately installed him as its No. 1 challenger. That made it mandatory that Rossman fight him again within six months. Now that Rossman has lost the championship—undoubtedly in part because of a broken hand—one has to wonder where he will be ranked among the WBA's contenders."

 

That makes me rethink my H2H assessment.

I feel pretty sure Qawi would beat Victor, but I’m not sure he could beat Christodoulou, Waldemar Schmidt and the entire WBA at the same time.

 

I'm more or less on Galindez's side here. By the late 1970s, the idea of all three judges coming from one fighter's home country was rapidly falling out of fashion, for obvious reasons. If Rossman had refused a fight with three Argentinian judges (regardless of which province in Argentina they came from) I'd have understood it as well.

The standard for selecting officials for world title fights had moved on beyond "let's line the pockets of three of our local guys." I'm glad the the Nevada athletic commission didn't get away with that crap.

 

Then turn down the fight outright. Or negotiate for it in your contract. Don’t leave the champion and paying fans standing there waiting for you to come out of the dressing room. It’s 100% bush league. He should have had to pay Rossman’s purse and refund every ticket.

 

This stuff was up for debate until the day of the fight, so probably not something that was spelled out in the contract. As best as I can tell, from the SI article by Pat Putnam, this is the basic timeline of events:

Jan. 1979: The WBA's legal counsel informs the Nevada athletic commission that Nevada can choose the officials for the upcoming fight in exchange for becoming a member of the WBA.
Appx. Feb. 19 (listed as "a few days before the fight"): The Nevada commission calls the WBA representative to ask if the promise still stood, and they are told that it does.
Appx. Feb. 20: The WBA president informs Bob Arum, the fight's promoter, that the WBA isn't going to allow the fight to take place with an American ref and three American judges. Victor Galindez's concerns about four American officials played a part in the decision. This kicks off a series of phone calls in which Arum believes that he has extracted a compromise: one American judge, two neutral judges, and a neutral ref (but all of the neutrals coming from non-Argentina Latin countries).
Feb. 23: Late in the day, the Nevada commission votes to join the WBA and to use four Nevada officials for the next day's fight.
Feb. 24 (2 AM): Arum informs the WBA of Nevada's decision. The WBA president expresses his disapproval but says that the fight has WBA sanction as of that moment. However, he states that at fight time a telegram would arrive in Las Vegas indicating that the WBA is reviewing the fight's status as a sanctioned bout, creating the possibility for a rematch in the next ninety days.
7:30 AM: The WBA sends its telegram. It states that it will not sanction today's fight. As soon as Galindez reads it, he states that he will not fight.
1:15 PM: Galindez arrives at the arena and asks about the officials. He is told that all four are American and refuses to fight.
2:10: Galindez leaves the arena.
2:21: Bob Arum announces the cancellation of the fight and refunds for all tickets.

Plenty of blame to go around here, but if I'm Victor Galindez, and I wake up to find out that I'm scheduled for a fifteen-rounder in which I can't win the title because it's no longer a sanctioned bout, I'm not fighting either.

 

This all presupposes that it’s not Victor’s handlers calling the shots with their WBA buddies. He had his own hand-picked ref and chief judge at most of his fights. He had every advantage in basically every title fight and kept ‘somehow’ winning all the close fights, getting the timeout when he got cut, etc.

It says right in your post: “Victor Galindez’s concerns about four American judges plays a part in the decision.”

This isn’t VIctor showing up and finding out anything. The WBA were his baggage handlers. It stinks to high heavens.

 

I'm sure Galindez did exert some influence there. But it seems like up until the night before the fight he was under the impression that there would be one American official and three neutral ones (none of which, apparently, was to be Christodoulou). He didn't exactly have a lot of time to pull out ahead of time.

And again, I don't really have a problem with his refusal to fight in those circumstances. To my eyes the vacillating WBA and the overstepping Nevada commission came out looking worse than Galindez.

 

I don’t think it is overstepping for a commission mandated by the government of a state to oversee a sport insisting on its officials — the ones it licenses and trained and know the abilities of — doing their jobs in their state.

Neutral has no meaning if the WBA is sending in its officials to oversee its pet fighter. What country someone is from doesn’t dictate neutrality — and the WBA clearly backed Galindez throughout his championship reign.

Victor had a chance to negotiate it into his contract where judges would be from and clearly did not. The NSAC would have rejected the contract if it included language that said Galindez got to bring in judges or a ref to suit him or to supplant Nevada officials, so the fight never would have been scheduled for there.

I am quite sure that Galindez went to bed the night before quite secure in the idea that ‘his guys’ would prevail and bring in friendly officials to make sure things went his way. But if he signed a contract to fight Mike Rossman over 15 rounds on a certain date in a certain place, then he should be obligated to fulfill that contract regardless of who is officiating. Challengers don’t get to dictate such things … unless the challenger is a WBA golden boy who has more power than the champion or the commission that presides over boxing in the venue where the fight is held.

And when they made Rossman fight Victor anyway, guess who the WBA appointed? Scoring ref Stanley Christodoulou, Waldemar Schmidt and Victor Cellis, a ‘neutral’ Venezuelan who had previous refereed a successful Galindez defense and would referee his next one, too. Hmmm. Good thing they found some ‘neutral’ officials.

 

Hi Saint.
My oh my, you have put up some great posts in my time, this one is up there with them, some crucial observations, on the results and or officials of his most defining fights, of which I was unaware, as I suspect lots of others were in similar vein, and you have his fighting style down to T, I was on the fence as to who was greater, and who would prevail had they met in their primes, thanks to your illuminating and pinpoint article that has been erased, again thanks for holding my hand, and showing me the path .
Stay safe buddy, chat soon.

 

He was a bit like Toney and Duran at times,his output varies for each fights.

 

I’ve never been terribly enamored of Galindez. As described here, way too many dubious decisions, and his style always annoyed me. Wait and wait, then when you get pissed off enough at getting jabbed to death, sail in with a violent flurry until you get tired, then retreat to the ropes to catch your breath. Do this for 15 rounds and get rewarded for it. Every time.

Seems like he had little in the way of any real plan in fights, knowing that unless you stopped him, he didn’t really need one.

 

I love Galindez and grew to his style eventually,but that bit shocked me when I first watched him tbh,I forgot who recommended him to me since he's similar to Duran (@Dorrian_Grey ,@Dynamicpuncher or @Flo_Raiden maybe) and when I checked him out he literally had an output of Floyd Mayweather with consistency of Toney and Duran combined,his Argentinian style still awesome tho.

 

Victor Emilio isn’t mentioned in this story (although the president of the WBA for much of the corruption reported on here was Fernando Mandry Galindez, a Venezuelan unrelated to Victor … as far as anyone knows) who was also the one who was pulling the strings when Victor walked out on Rossman and was rewarded rather than penalized.

This lays out the pattern of WBA payoffs, certain fighters with corrupt connections being given special treatment in defiance of WBA rules while others unconnected are screwed over time and again. There are cash payoffs (day-of-fight ‘transactions’ where the WBA rep collects the purse or the fight doesn’t go on, even while a non-corrupt commissioner tries to make sure the fighter actually gets the money) — in one case the WBA hiring a guard to watch over a safe deposit box at a hotel to make sure no one but the WBA rep collects an extorted $100K in cash that is supposed to be Eusebio Pedroza’s purse — and numerous other things like promoters having to buy lavish gifts for WBA kingpins and having fights suddenly sanctioned or fighters suddenly ranked.

If you scroll down to the very bottom section on Sammy Serrano (it seems like the article is ending, but there’s more at the bottom), you will see the exact pattern Victor Emilio had in his favor — certain favored judges and officials and all-Latin officiating crews appointed as protectorates for his title fights (at least two or three times Serrano, a Puerto Rican, had all-PR officiating crews … but all-American isn’t allowed?).

Pat Putnam’s incredible investigative skills paint a picture that we saw play out when Rossman got screwed. I’m sure all the right money ended up in all the right hands when strongman Mandry Galindez swooped in to take care of business.

To act like Victor’s team wasn’t complicit in this is to say there’s no evidence that the sky is blue. To suggest that the WBA’s judging cabal was ‘neutral’ is beyond laughable:

https://vault.si.com/vault/1981/03/...bious-practices-from-its-power-base-in-panama