Is Ali the HW GOAT?

He's without a shadow of a doubt in the top 10. So that's definitely not 'nowhere near'

 

Joe Louis is the man here.

 

I'm really not qualified enough to know.

I have said before though that sometimes when you have a dominant champion people think a division is weak
If you have 2-4 evenly matched fighters who win and lose against each other. People tend to think it's a stronger division

 

If we are talking H2H then it's Ali easily. Pre Draft, Cleveland William's Ali beats everyone and possibly goes undefeated through 50 bouts.

In terms of historical significance, it's either Ali, Louis or Dempsey and I'd put Ali ahead due to modern media being more worldwide.

And I'm no Ali, the man, supporter. Just being factual.

I suppose Usyk has to be top ten in historical significance....won undisputed title while his country was at war. Plus only second CW to win HW title PLUS # 1 or 2 best CW ever.

Head to head, maybe Usyk could crack top 15.

 

Well, the idea that he's nowhere near the top ten is a bit silly. Of course he is.

But he is not "without a shadow of a doubt in the top 10."

Some have him there, some don't.

My top ten:

1. Muhammad Ali
2. Joe Louis
3. Lennox Lewis
4. George Foreman
5. Rocky Marciano
6. Larry Holmes
7. Joe Frazier
8. Mike Tyson
9. Sonny Liston
10. Wladimir Klitschko

Everyone of the above have a case as to why they're greater.


He's a work in progress.
We'll have a better idea of where to place him in a couple of years time.

That said, if he wins his next (final ?) three fights (hopefully Dubois, Parker and Kabayel), any doubts will be removed.

In such a scenario, I would probably put him somewhere in the top 3 - 6.

 

Mostly agree, but I would put Usyk higher than 15 head to head.
Best for best, I don't think there were ten fighters I would favour to beat him.
That number might even be less than five.

 

It was a spot on post.
Usyk is undoubtedly a great fighter (and proved it again and again) but lacks the precocity or the longevity (two things that Ali possessed as your post demonstrated it) to be considered as the GOAT.

 

BS, Sanders was an optional mandatory for Wladimirs belt, Sanders was always going to fight him after signing.

https://www.boxing247.com/news/Klitschko-Sanders-Preview.php

Just to get you tilted Lewis would destroy Wladimir he cannot fight on the inside, uppercuts would level him. Lewis didn't duck a rematch with Vitali, Wladimir did after Sanders obliterated him. Sanders always wondered why Klitschko didn't rematch him. "Nobody beat me the way Corrie did"

https://www.espn.com/boxing/story/_...ay-corrie-sanders-did-says-wladimir-klitschko

https://www.boxingnews24.com/2010/06/corrie-sanders-doesn’t-know-why-wladimir-klitschko-never-sought-a-rematch/

 

The other thing which I didn't bother to add because I wanted to keep it terse is that Usyk is a master at various forms of grappling, and has studied them before he started boxing. It actually seems pretty obvious that he would like to show that off a bit. I can't imagine why he would get any hate for that.

 

lol

 

The Scene is, after all, a Scene.

 

You didn't need to tell me that, although i think he deserved a warning before he got booted considering those two don't like eachother

 

The Scene, Some of the stuff I’ve seen some posters type on there… Wow. lol Yeah it’s a bit of a zoo. And some posters on there that say the vile stuff are on here but won’t mention any names Anyway… this forum is better