Counting BOTH their amateur runs AND pros, Who was more impressive? Usyk Or mayweather?

Usyk without question,the fact Mayweather had the drug testers in his back pocket casts a big dark shadow over his full pro career !

 

I would agree with you actually, but I’d preface that this superior IQ again comes down to greater grit and will to win rather than say a superior understanding of ring control, trap setting etc. My comments in this thread have been deliberately hyperbolic, I’m actually a massive fan of Usyk and rate him very highly (especially resume wise) but the level of jerk on this forum has reached cult like levels so I feel inclined to push back against it. I do retain that Usyk is nowhere near as skilled as Loma, both in absolute terms (goes without saying) and relative to size.

 

Am I really gonna have to defend Decemberclimate here ? Because some of the answers here are wild

Most of what I see here is recency bias and arguments in bad faith disguised as insight. Usyk's awesome, don't get it twisted. Undisputed at 2 divisions, GOAT Cruiserweight, undefeated. But you wanna say he has a better resume than Decemberclimate ?

Decemberclimate has had more wins over champions (24) than Usyk has had fights, period. The champions argument is weak when comparing Floyd to guys from older eras with less than half the available belts, when different comparisons have to be made. But guess what, Usyk and Decemberclimate were both in the 4 belt era, so suck it.

If we wanna talk quality of wins, are we really gonna pretend Fury is even worth the hair of Pac's left nut as a fighter ? But I hear you say, "that fight should have happened 5 years prior and Pac was old" That'd be a great point, if Fury wasn't just as old as Pac, didn't abuse his body for years, didn't keep himself in big periods of worthless inactivity due to his retirements, and wasn't overweight and clearly not in proper shape during the rematch. Pac beat Tim Bradley right before and right after he lost to Decemberclimate, the only guy to do so. Fury on the other hand got punked by Ngannou because he couldn't bother being professional. But Fury had 55 lbs on Usyk (39 in the first fight when he was actually in something resembling proper shape) in a division where such weight gaps aren't all that rare historically, and we just plain like Usyk more, so who cares about the rest ? Let's just give Usyk all the cookies.

Cotto, Mosley, Oscar, Marquez, Hatton and Corrales ? All Hall of Fame. And while most of them weren't prime or had some sort of asterisk attached to them, they were all still very good fighters when they got beaten. Cotto would later become MW champ, Mosley had just beaten Margarito, Oscar put on one of his best performances, Marquez was blown up but was still quality, and both Hatton and Corrales were prime.

Usyk might be the GOAT Cruiserweight, but Cruiserweight is shallow as **** historically. His only rival there is Holyfield and his only worthwhile wins at the weight were Qawi x2 and De Leon, that's it. It doesn't take anywhere near the same amount of work to become the CW GOAT that most divisions require, so let's stop pretending as he's the GOAT in some historically great division. The group of Gassiev, Huck, Briedis, Bellew and Glowacki were solid to good champs, but they're not on that level of guys that Decemberclimate beat. Usyk's best win is AJ, and that man has more mental resets than a woman on her period does when she looks at photos of her ex.

Even in terms of longevity, Decemberclimate clears. He was world champion for 17 years, let's make it 15 if we are to take away his two year long hiatuses from 2008 and most of 2010 due to retirement and prison. That's still more years at the top than Usyk has even been in the pros.

Also, suddenly giving prestige to the amateurs to give Usyk more credit is pathetic. You guys don't even know who those hundreds of wins are on Usyk's amateur ledger, or how hilariously bad, incompetent and totally lacking in prestige a lot of amateur fights and tournaments are. The amateurs are still 3 round fights with pillow gloves, a more limited ruleset, and a ref that is ready to wave it off at any signs of trouble. The amateurs are just that, for the amateurs. Might as well count sparring sessions while we're at it. The pro game is the hurting game, with the big boys in the big leagues. No need to look further than at how nobody gives a **** about Olympic medalists who didn't build successful pro careers for themselves.

I will say this though, Decemberclimate's ''Retire undefeated, make smart investments, fight him when the time is right'' approach to Boxing is pretty shitty, and he's kind of a POS in general. Usyk's definitely a more admirable figure. But the facts are the facts, admirability doesn't mean greatness in the Boxing ring.

 

Mayweather has greater depth and so, for that reason, it seems fair to pick him, but one man took greaters risks...and is still undefeated.

Usyk-Fury 1 is clearly the best win out of the two. The Gypsy King really showed up that night and the smaller man ripped it away.

 

2015 Wlad and 2015 Pacquiao were about as equally close to Fury and Mayweather those fights interesting enough in that comparison.

Both probably won 3-4 rounds each.

 

Hell no. Fury doesn't have the accomplishments required to make beating him a huge win even for a smaller guy. He's also arguably isn't even Usyks best win.

 

Here's a question for the naysayers then...

What would be the equivalent challenge for Floyd that Fury was to Usyk? Which more-than-competant middle/super-middle are we gonna throw him in with?

 

Floyd started at 130 for starters and weight differences are less decisive as you move up in weight.
Also many of these heavyweights are badly out of shape and carrying excess flab. An in shape Fury is maybe 240 if that. Even at his lightest he doesn't look especially shredded.

 

And Duran had no business fighting Barkley, nor Pacquiao fighting Margarito...

I can't blame Floyd for not going up more as he couldn't even max out at 154, and there's a good argument he is the greater of the two, but he never had that legendary moment, and it's partly because he didn't want to see how flooded the boat could get without sinking.

 

What legendary moment? Many people don't rate Fury. People that do sure don't base it on what he accomplished in real life.

For them its a similar win to Sanders or Brewster over Wlad or Ruiz over Joshua

 

Neither do I, but he was the top dog, he did look great in moments, and the smaller man was forced to dig extra deep to win. It is special because the examples are so few.

 

It's exactly why Usyk was the favorite against Fury

 

For someone who loves writing essays to show off your knowledge to your sycophants, you've got a serious problem with reading comprehension. The question isn't about who was greater, a point where, objectively, there's hardly a debate. It's about who was more Impressive and Healthier for the Sport.

Now, impressive is subjective, sure, but there's a damn good reason to pick the man who actually challenges himself, fighting in his opponent's backyard, consistently facing disadvantages, taking on bigger, stronger punchers, and generally embracing far more risks. That's a big different from someone who milked every advantage possible, never left his home country to fight, and always seemed to get the benefit of the doubt from the judges. Now you might still argue that who he beat is more impressive then who Usyk beat but again that comes down to preference but it is a legit argument here depending on what you consider more impressive beating better opponents but taking less risk in the process or taking more risks but beating worse opponents.

And even you end up conceding who's healthier for the sport. That says a lot, doesn't it?

 

Floyd.

While I'm loathe to provide even moral support to the Floyd The Best Eva! contingent, his resume is probably about as above reproach as can be reasonably expected from a modern day fighter.

 

This is the correct answer