To you, do Usyk's cruiserweight wins count towards his status as a heavyweight great?

Which is pretty sad isn't it ? That was 7 years ago and the win aged like crap

 

aged like crap? stop the trolling. Bakole has been in the top 10 for the last few years. And he was seen as the boogeyman up until his recent couple of fights, a lot of people were high on him

 

No he hasn't, he was seen as dangerous fringe contender off his Yoka win until he beat Anderson who is unproven. Bakole got a gift decision against Kuzmin and lost to Ajagba. Parker wiped him out. He was never a top 10 heavyweight in the world nor does he have the record. If Bakole had never lost to Hunter you would never glaze him like this.

If you consider Bakole to be a good win, couldn't cut it guys like Savarese, Coetzer are even better heavyweights historically

 

If the fights took place at CW, they count for CW. It's really that simple.

 

I never said it was or claimed it to be

Not something I have tried to agree or disagree with

You haven't answered the questions
That says it all there, though I'm expecting you to believe you have and say something like odd, I just have

 

Each to their own
So I guess you would feel a rematch wouldn't be terrible to see if Usyk can beat Americas #1 boxrec HW?

Obviously this is all made up below but if for example Hunter beat Parker and Dubois for example, you feel Usyks win over Hunter wouldn't mean anything as it stands because they were a stone lighter?

 

Your entire argument is Gassiev and Hunter were ranked at heavyweight, but they beat nobody of note apart from Hunter who drew with a 40 year old Povetkin. Rankings can be corrupted. So the wins aren't historically significant at heavyweight. They are however historically significant at cruiserweight and count alot at cruiserweight. It's really that simple. Holyfields cruiserweight opponents can easily make heavyweight if you turn the clock back

 

no sir . Having 5 opponents on your legacy and cleaning two top fighters out this 5 is imho surely enough to deserve some respect and notice but in no way enough to get two hw undisputed shots straight away , ducking mandatory defence fights .

 

If that HW puts himself in a top position, by winning meaningful fights at HW, and gets a shot at Usyk, sure why not. Doesn't make the original anything but still a CW fight.

It would still count as just a CW win. That's how it works.

 

When you go up a weight division as a champion, you got pull with the orgs - go up undisputed and you deserve to get a title shot once you're ready.

Usyk didn't get "two hw undisputed shots straight away" like you said, anyway.

He took two warm up fights to get rounds whilst getting used to carrying the extra weight.

Then, two years after going up to heavyweight, he fought the unified champion (not undisputed) for 3 of the belts... And won... And won the rematch.

Then he fought the hottest prospect in the division, who turned up deliberately fouling, and beat him with ease.

Then... Finally Fury found his balls and the actual undisputed fight happened - and Usyk won clearly in a competitive bout... Then won the rematch.


Here's a timeline for you... Cropped short, just to make the facts pop...
12/10/2019 - Usyks first fight at heavyweight (Witherspoon).
25/09/2021 - Usyk wins three belts from AJ.
18/05/2024 - Usyk wins the fourth belt, from Fury, to become undisputed.

I'm not sure in what world four and a half years = "straight away" but I don't think it's this one.

Usyk has undeniably fought the best on offer, risked his zero about as much as realistically possible... Some people are just impossible to please, I guess - or maybe just desperately hoping contrarianism makes them sound smart...

 

@mrbigshot persistently trolls usyk, I wouldn’t get wound up if I were you. If usyk at 38 fights everyone in the top 20 within a year I’m sure he’ll still find something to pick against.

 

Ummmm......no.

I didn't count Ichiro"s hits in Japan towards his Major League Baseball stats, so why would I consider Usyk's CW wins when assessing his HW legacy??

 

hm ... with a legacy of witherspoon and chisora he really deserved a title shot at hw ? And just one opponent later ( dubois ) he really deserved an undisputed shot ? And now with 5 opponents in total he now deserves a second undisputed shot without fighting top contenders first , carefully circumnavigating mandatory title defences ?

Cmon ...

@rolzone : i,m not trolling usyk , honestly give him much respect for achievements at CW but at hw its imho a bit ... you know

 

That's like comparing a banana to an apple.

 

Do Usyk's cruiserweight wins count towards his status as a heavyweight great?

Of course not. The question answers itself.