A Lukewarm Look At The Rumble In The Jungle (One sided?)

I also dont understand why so many belittle Foreman because he was comprehensively beaten by...the greatest heavyweight of all time. Ali was all wrong for a fighter with George's style. Styles make fights. I personally dont rate George highly in my 'list' but my goodness he was a great fighter.

 

Anyone who had seen Ali’s career up to that point knew he also had weaknesses. I mean, what fighter doesn’t?

The second Peralta fight was, what, 3 1/2 years before George fought Ali? The boxing public had seen Foreman improve and then seen him bowl over with ease the two other top heavyweights in the world who weren’t named Ali.

They had also seen Ali decline, his legs looking less fresh each time. A huge puncher on the rise vs a starting-to-age boxer on the decline, as it was seen at the time.

If Foreman was regarded by insiders as all smoke and mirrors at the time, some of them would have slipped off to Vegas, bet their life savings on Ali and lived like kings. I gather that didn’t happen.

Here’s Dempsey, Tunney, Louis, Sharkey and Braddock — all living former heavyweight champions — making their predictions at the time. All chose Foreman, pretty much all saying easily. (Frazier was asked but declined, saying he just wanted the winner):

https://www.boxingforum24.com/threads/1974-more-ex-champs-ali-foreman-predictions.664606/

Any idea looking back that ‘it should have been obvious to anyone that Ali would beat Foreman’ is Monday morning quarterbacking. It’s easy to see in hindsight. Prevailing opinion at the time is that George would batter Ali.

Nobody knew Ali would have a third act, and that last stretch would elevate him to truly become regarded as the greatest heavyweight ever.

(Of course the prevailing feeling at the time of Tyson-Holyfield was that Mike would steamroll Evander. What matters isn’t what people think is going to happen, but what actually occurs when two men are in the ring.)

 

You might have missed, I said exactly the same in an earlier post. Ali battered George. He was better than him in every department.

 

....I wonder if Usyk v Dubois 2 might be this generations Ali Foreman? I am in a minoroty in that I think Usyk has aged, has looked vulnerable on occasion lately and Dubois will run him over this time. It seems that not only most of the boxing cognoscenti disagree with me, so does history....

 

No offense, but I’m not going to read it word for word.

 

I think Fury vs. Wilder II is as close as we’ll get.

 

Joe said whatever you think Ali will do he probably won't do.

 

Hey bud. I'm back ready to debunk your claims. This is a fight I'm well versed in & have watched several times. I watched the 1st round again to refresh my memory (as I haven't watched it in a long time) & took notes on key moments in every exchange they had. Here it is:

Muhammad Ali vs George Foreman: Round 1 Analysis

- Ali lands the first punch - a straight right. No damage. (2:51)

- Ali lands a 2-1 combo that buzzes (but doesn't hurt) Foreman (2:31).

- Foreman chases him into the corner, uses the long-guard to manipulate his movement & lands a left to Ali's side & a right uppercut to the midsectiom. Minor damage (2:29-2:21).

- Another quick right lead by Ali. Does no damage (2:14).

Foreman lands a light body shot in the clinch. No damage (2:12)
- Ali tries for a 1-2,. He lands the left, but misses the right & falls off balance. No damage (2:02).

- Foreman grapples Ali to get control of him & nails him with a thudding body shot to his left rib. Little damage (2:01).

- Ali tries for a jab. Foreman blocks it with his right glove. Ali then comes back with a straight right that nails Foreman through his guard. Foreman isn't hurt, but he felt that shot. Moderate damage (1:55-1:51).

- Foreman quickly gains control by using his long-guard to smother Ali & spin him around as Ali holds onto his head. He nails him with 2 good shots to the ribs again. Minor damage (1:50-1:48)

- Ali tries for a 2-1 again, but is neutralised by Foreman's long-guard. He the tries for a left hook, but Foreman ducks it & nails him with a wide counter-left hook that hits the side of Ali's head. Ali eyes bucked a bit wider & he's more alert after he ate that left. Ali backs into the ropes (willingly) as Foreman lunges in for a wild left hook at Ali's head that misses, ending this sequence with Ali headlocking Foreman. Moderate damage (1:43-1:37).

- Ali skates off the ropes smoothly. Foreman follows. Ali then nails him with an overhand right that goes over his guard. Minor damage (1:31).

- At the same moment Foreman is nailed he, lands a stiff right to the body that makes Ali's face grimace. He holds onto Foreman's head again. Foreman then wildly attacks Ali, throwing swinging shots - none connecting, but making Ali uncomfortable & losing grip of Foreman's head. He tries for an uppercut but Ali slips it. Moderate damage (1:31-1:27).

- Foreman tries an attack with a left & right, but misses & is tied up. No damage (1:24-1:20).

- Foreman tries another attack, but is unsuccessful. Ali ties him up. Nothing happens from both men. No damage (1:16-1:11).

- Ali tries for a jab. Foreman slips it, but Ali gains control of his head. Foreman loses balance. He throws an unorthodox right uppercut & left hook (still off balance) - the left nailing Ali (but of little significance). Ali still has control of Foreman, until the ref separates them. No damage (1:07-1:01).

- Ali tries for a 1-2, only partially landing as Foreman was ducking & grappling. He the clinches Foreman. No damage (0:58-0:54).

- Ali goes against the ropes. Foreman pursues him, backs him against the ropes with his long-guard & throws a wild uppercut that misses. He then follows up with 2 right hooks to Ali's jaw & two rights to his midsection. Ali looks very uncomfortable now. The ref separates them as Ali is holding on tightly. Moderate damage (0:50-0:39).

- Foreman throws a wild left hook the skims past Ali. Ali lands a light left that does no damage. Foreman keeps coming. He backs Ali into the ropes. As Ali tries for a right hand Foreman ducks to the side & nails him with a big right to the rib cage again (the hardest punch he's thrown so far) he follows up with some clubbing shots that don't really land, but make Ali uncomfortable. However, Ali still has control over Foreman's head. Moderate damage. (0:36-0:29).

- Foreman breaks out of the clinch use his long-guard to manoeuvre Ali to the right to land a jab. He tries for another jab, but Ali counters, but doesn't do any damage. No damage by either (0:27- 0:24).

- Foreman lands a left high on Ali's head that has more weight than power behind it. It pushes Ali to the side a bit. They trade jabs. Foreman's intercepts Ali's. Ali continues to back into the ropes as Foreman trails him. Ali explodes with a 2-1, the right missing, the left landing. Foreman then neutralises Ali's attack with his long-guard, tries for a left that misses, then shoves Ali into the ropes & pounds him to the body with a right hand. Decent damage by both. (0:23-0:12).

- Foreman shoves Ali off of him, & throws a 1-2. The left land & right land partially. He goes for another right that is more effective & gets Ali at the side of the head. The bell rings, ending Round One. No damage (0:09-0:00).

Doesn't sound like a one-sided, lukewarm fight to me. This sounds like a very exciting back & forth round. Sure it got more one-sided as the fight went on (mainly because Foreman was rushing & punched himself out) but that 1st round was pretty even & could have gone either way. Foreman for the harder more thudding shots, Ali for the snappier, cleaner & more stinging shots.

 

That was a top read, kudos.

 

I did watch it just now. Here are my observations:
1. The fight was basically over after two rounds.
2. The third round was Foreman's last stand. Rather than changing tactics, he showed his limitations by only trying harder with the same ineffective tactics.
3. Round 5 was stupid and unnecessary by Ali, but he didn't pay the price. He was giving Foreman the left side of his body and didn't seem bothered by Foreman's shots there. Someone like Tyson would've caused serious damage to Ali in that round, but that's not who was in front of him.
4. Foreman's inside game was so weak that it took him until round 7 to land his first inside uppercut. Foreman's tactics for most of the fight could be described as throwing mid range shots while in close quarters.
5. Foreman appeared to quit at the end. He seemed to rise right at ten without much issue. If you want to make that thread, go for it.

After watching it, I'm sure that Fury and Lewis would totally murder him with roughhousing and infighting if they went for it. Foreman would be useless. Andy Ruiz would also have his way. He was too tough and Foreman was too wide open. Toney from the Holyfield fight would also likely stop him. People forget the Toney calmly endured a spirited attack from Holyifled in the first four rounds of that fight.