Could Sonny Liston have made it undefeated vs Louis title defenses?

Terrell didnt fight, "tall".

 

It would not. McBride was bigger by 43 pounds and a stronger man with better skills and punch, he would get beaten, but not like Wepner until later rounds, where Sonny tires and then McBride knocks him out cold same way Martin did, maybe even faster.

 

I checked. This fight was a year before Cleveland was literally shot.

 

Thanks.

A possibility that I hadn't considered is that Liston takes the Tyson route: he decides that he's too old for this ***, and gives up rather than continue taking punches while exhausted.

Not something I'd bet money on either way. Depends on how determined Sonny's mindset was going into the Wepner bout. If he doesn't give up, he probably wins it despite how spent he'd be.

 

Our mutual mistake, then. Yeah, Cleveland looks better in this than against Ali.

 

That's how I see it . I think Sonny would still had enough professional pride to see the job through.
Such is the brutality of boxing that once a fighter feels he is past it he must be mighty tempted
to chuck it in during fights in the later part of his career.It's amazing that these men,on the whole,
still put in a decent effort once they started to decline.

 

Yeah. He quit twice against Ali, but a fight with McBride would be a last chance sort of thing, and he'd probably be willing to go out on his shield like he did against Martin, if need be, rather than give up a chance at climbing to one more title shot. Though with the way he'd look in later rounds, the sharks who saw the fight would start circling, and I doubt people would be clamoring for the champ to give him a title shot.

 

So would McBride,a man who lost to Tomasz Ademek be able to this to Sonny Liston.Adamek was a decent
fighter but nowhere near the same class as an ATG like Sonny Liston.

 

Buddy,I have to disagree that Sonny quit against Ali.Perhaps this is a subject we can discuss another time.

 

Oh for goodness sake stop behaving like a child.

 

Oh come on.Yes any victory over the great Sam Langford is a fine achievement but that was Sam Langford
very much in decline.This result,and his victory over Jack Dempsey are the only achievements of Meehan's
career.Otherwise his resume is,quite frankly, horrible.

 

Fair enough.

I mean, he certainly did in the first one, so I think for purposes of this thread, the point would stand.

 

We're not talking about a prime Sonny Liston here, though. We're not talking about a great heavyweight head to head by that point. 2011 Adamek was better than that Sonny.

 

Ali always and invariably fought tall

 

Observations. I'm rewatching Ali-Terrell. I watched the infamous second round three times where Terrell said Ali drgged his face against the ropes and blinded him, WWE style. I added WWE style. It never happened. Howard Cosell and George Chuvalo who were calling the fight didn't see it either. The argument keeps getting made that Ali's leaning back fron punches instead of ducking made him susceptible to the jab and point to Norton having some success with it as proof. That was a 31 year old, 32 year old and 34 year old Ali. The laws of physiology are immutable. He had slowed down by then. If a 24 year old Tyson gets excuses for being KTFO at 24 Ali gets exuses for slowing down at 31, 32, and 34 years old.