Could Sonny Liston have made it undefeated vs Louis title defenses?

So according to you Leotis Martin is greater than Lennox Lewis, Vitali and Wladimir Klitschko because he started out as a light-heavyweight. Nice to know that you must have a very high opinion of Leotis Martin.

Jerry Quarry was the first man to defeat Earnie Shavers,Mac Foster and Ron Lyle.Jerry also gave a
terrific performance against Joe Frazier in the Ring's Fight of the Year in 1969.There is plenty of
justification for saying Jerry was possibly the finest heavyweight to never win the World Heavyweight
Championship.

 

Yep,as formidable as Big George was there are a few guys like yourself who feel that Jerry could have pulled
a shock win over Mr Foreman.

 

Not true, he started as an LHW and did not achieve anything, if he did, I could then rate him as a great fighter, since you pulled fighters who also started lower weights who achieved something, unlike Martin, who did not beat anyone good.

And so was Ali and Jimmy Young, you compared Quarry, who was a counterpuncher, those sluggers suited his style but when he met boxers and pressure fighters, he always lost his biggest fights.

The finest man to never win the title would be Ken Norton or David Tua, but Quarry is up there with them.

 

Whoa hang on.There is every indication that Leotis Martin could have had a terrific career if he had'nt suffered that career-ending injury against Sonny Liston.

 

But he ducked fighters like Langford, Jeannete, and McVey, not only Harry Wills, he even admitted he didn't want to fight Langford.

 

Woulda shoulda, does not count, if he did, then we could say different, but since he did not, I would rate him much lower than Meehan.

If my grandma had d... she would be my grandad, but if...

 

Agreed.Jerry did have a terrific record against power-punchers.It's the sort of fight where the
favoured fighter wins but he's damned glad to avoided defeat.That's probably the likely scenario
that would have surrounded Foreman vs Quarry.

 

Oh come on....there is plenty of evidence that Leotis could have been a major force in the heavyweight
division.

 

I hate to be repetitive but why would Dempsey agree to fight Harry Wills if he really did
intend to avoid all the great blck fighters of his era ?

 

Liston couldn't knockout Burt Whitehurst in two fights but now he is favoured to stop Billy Conn?
Couldn't stop one armed Eddie Machen and has one KO in three fights against Marty Marshall but he stops a prime Walcott?
How? These guys took Louis to the brink, a guy who had demolished Lee Ramage twice and knocked out Bob Pastor. Against "movers" Louis has six knockout wins, plus the decisions over Pastor and Farr. He was demonstrably superior to Liston in dispatching quick footed foes. Liston has zero wins over ranked movers, if he beat Walcott, Pastor and Conn it would have to be by decision.
You're also putting a lot of stock on those 10 extra lbs and 4 inches of reach to make up for Liston's severe speed, and timing discrepancy compared to Louis, not withstanding how Louis coped when faced with overwhelming odds with the only way to stop him being to fully beat him to unconsciousness.
Conditioning and stamina also come into play for late round power that allowed Louis to pull through in the first Conn fight.
Those extra 10 lbs Liston has on him must be worth their weight in gold to somehow make up for all that.

 

Because Wills was the worst of them, he didn't want the risk against the worst of them.

 

He wasn't anything, outboxed by Bonavena a slugger with low skills and TKOed by Ellis a LHW.

We rate fighters based on what they did not on what could happend you know.

 

I

I think you'll that Jimmy Ellis was a heavyweight.At the very least Leotis Martin was a
first-rate puncher.

 

No way.Harry Wills was clearly one of the most formidable guys who could
have challenged Dempsey for the title.

 

He was the guy wih worst losses and just a contender, he was not near the level of even past prime Langford.