Carlos Roque "Shotgun" Monzón vs. "Marvelous" Marvin Nathaniel Hagler - Definitive Classic Breakdown

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by IntentionalButt, Aug 12, 2025.


Escopeta or The Marvelous One? VOTE ONLY WHEN YOU'RE READY, THIS CANNOT BE CHANGED LATER!

  1. Monzón on points

    53.0%
  2. Monzón by stoppage

    2.4%
  3. Draw

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  4. Hagler on points

    43.4%
  5. Hagler by stoppage

    1.2%
  1. Yorbals

    Yorbals Member Full Member

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    Nice find with that interview ‘Tommy heya’

    as much as I like Hagler, I have to go with Monzon.

    Hagler was so skilled, anybody who came straight at him could be nullified and beaten up.
    But Monzon wouldn’t do that, he’d keep it as long as possible and keep Hagler on the end of his jab. Hagler has a fine jab himself of course, but Monzon wins that battle here.
    Hagler for all of his talents, could be confused and out-thought by the smartest boxers.
    Monzon is as classic a ring general as you will find.
    Hagler was stronger than many of his opponents , but he isn’t as strong as Monzon, Monzon will tie him up whenever he has to. For all of his macho image, he wasn’t like a Hearns who would try to out punch Hagler.

    Monzon doesn’t have the skills of a Duran, but he brings that same kind of ring generalship and presence in to the ring. With his strength and size that would enough to beat Hagler on points.
    Monzon UD
     
  2. IntentionalButt

    IntentionalButt Guy wants to name his çock 'macho' that's ok by me

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    So, my naked - and perhaps far reaching - ambition here is to make this thread the resource on the internet for detailed & intelligent Monzón vs. Hagler debate and analysis. Like, long after we are all dead, when people plug that match-up into a search engine (or whatever exists in lieu of search engines by then...thought queries in a VR headset?) this will be the foremost and richest trove of aggregated knowledge.

    Feels like we're well on our way. :deal:
     
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  3. IntentionalButt

    IntentionalButt Guy wants to name his çock 'macho' that's ok by me

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    For comparison's sake, as it's the closest we'll ever have to apples-to-apples:

    Benjamin "Bad Bennie" / "Black Robot" / "The Fighting Trashman" Briscoe vs. Carlos Roque "Escopeta" ("Shotgun") Monzón II:

    This content is protected



    Benjamin "Bad Bennie" / "Black Robot"/ "The Fighting Trashman" Briscoe vs. "Marvelous" Marvin Nathaniel Hagler:

    This content is protected



    I'll do a RBR for both soon. @Philosopher or anybody else, feel free to take a whack at it if you feel so inclined.
     
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  4. Yorbals

    Yorbals Member Full Member

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    This is a great point and one I’ve thought about as well.
    Confidence is so important. As you say Monzon had supreme confidence.
    I picked Monzon , but what would be interesting would be a prime, still speedy Hagler, with a trainer who could manage to convince him it is his only chance, going right at Monzon and going for broke.

    I don’t think that’s a fight we ever would have seen, but Hagler has a much better chance fighting like that.
    That’s basically how he beat Hearns, and I don’t think that was due to any tactical reason, just a personal dislike of Hearns.
    If he fought like that against Monzon, rage mode Hagler, it would be interesting to see how Monzon deals with it.
     
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  5. salsanchezfan

    salsanchezfan Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Excellent post. You wonder too, how Monzon fares against Hagler’s oft-used right hooks over an opponent’s low left(which Monzon was guilty of).

    Hmmm. Now I’m second guessing myself.
     
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  6. Journeyman92

    Journeyman92 MONZON VS HAGLER 2025 banned Full Member

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    Hey I expected a fun breakdown from you, when you’re arguing with me about things you bring up jaw sizes, rats wrestling and compare Foreman to Santa… I DEMAND BLOOD :mad:
     
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  7. Saintpat

    Saintpat Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    I feel like to do this well I need to put a bit more thought into it. Like I might rank Monzon higher, but H2H I wanna do a deeper dive as this is more of a ‘big-boy’ thread the way you’ve laid it out and don’t want to go off the cuff as it’s a really tough one.

    See, you could have done the same thing with Hagler and Hugo Corro and I’d have already answered, easy.
     
  8. Rollin

    Rollin Boxing Addict Full Member

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    'Let your plans be dark and impenetrable as night, and when you move, fall like a thunderbolt.'

    Sun Tzu.
     
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  9. Journeyman92

    Journeyman92 MONZON VS HAGLER 2025 banned Full Member

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    “GGG hits harder then Jimmy Young” - Sun Tzu
     
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  10. Journeyman92

    Journeyman92 MONZON VS HAGLER 2025 banned Full Member

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    He’d have been worse off with Cus, Cus handicapped every fighter he touched (ew)… the void of “Marvellous” Hagler would’ve been filled by Hamsho, Roldan, Peek-A-Boo Hagler and Vito passing around the belt, Benitez would’ve got brave, Leonard, Hearns and Duran to heaps sooner, it’d be a mess and like the post Tunney HW era everyone would’ve got a turn at wearing the belt lol… Hagler also mentioned by name Fullmer, Graziano and “The real Sugar Ray” has inspiration and “real champions” I don’t remember Rocky being as such but I won’t argue with Marvellous - odd how Monzon praised Hagler so much but when asked about Robinson he just said he was a better middleweight champion… so I’ve read.
     
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  11. IntentionalButt

    IntentionalButt Guy wants to name his çock 'macho' that's ok by me

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    Oh yeah, definitely the goal is to have you all really sink your teeth in and give your best & fullest answer. My updates are just in the interest of bookkeeping, not to rush people - everyone please take your time with it. :D
     
  12. IntentionalButt

    IntentionalButt Guy wants to name his çock 'macho' that's ok by me

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    Been a while since they've last swung around but would love to hear takes from guys like @BitPlayerVesti and @escudo.
     
  13. CST80

    CST80 De Omnibus Dubitandum Staff Member

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    Even though I wasn't tagged, and I avoid Classic like the bubonic plague, but I've seen Monzon and Hagler plenty of times, so I feel qualified enough to add my 2 cents. Monzon takes it. He controlled range far too well, his jab was too persistent and punishing, and it would be enough to give Hagler pause, certainly enough to prevent Hagler from consistently getting on the inside and wearing him down. Also Monzon's punch variety, angles and accurate counter punching would give Hagler fits. Hagler had a tendency to throw himself slightly off balance when overshooting his overhand left, which would give Monzon plenty of opportunities to walk him into his vicious right cross, counter left hooks and uppercuts. Mugabi who had a solid jab, a high work rate and threw from odd angles, gave Hagler fits early, enough to keep Hagler on the backfoot for long stretches and Monzon was like a super Mugabi, sans the wildly irresponsible brawling with far better defense on the front and backfoot, and a better chin. So I could see it going like the early rounds against Mugabi, but prolonged over 15. It wouldn't shock me if Monzon ended up walking Hagler down and battering him in the late rounds.
     
  14. IntentionalButt

    IntentionalButt Guy wants to name his çock 'macho' that's ok by me

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    Yeah, the only mods I figured would be interested were Mac and Rummy. Don't recall ever seeing you, Kirk, Serge or Zak in here. At least anytime in recent memory.

    Safe to say you see it Monzón by UD over 12, but late stoppage over 15?
     
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  15. IntentionalButt

    IntentionalButt Guy wants to name his çock 'macho' that's ok by me

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    Also, piggybacking off our conversation in the Usyk vs. Lewis thread... Monzón at least has the balls to admit that he found southpaws to be a huge pain in the ass and avoided them like the plague professionally. :lol:
     
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