James Toney vs Lennox Lewis

Absolute beating.

Toney has been elevated to proportions that he didn't actually come close to in real time.

It's confusing really.

 

Jimmy Ellis fought at 160 for a few years. He later beat the likes of Floyd Patterson, Jerry Quarry, Oscar Bonavena, George Chuvalo and Leotis Martin at heavyweight. He fought Ali and Shavers. He was a top five heavyweight for 3 years or more and was #3 for a while from memory. He dropped out one year then came back to be top 5 for multiple years again.

He did miles more than Toney ever did at heavyweight.

 

You think Canelo can do everything Toney did? - RJJ dipped his toe in at HW, JT became a real contender.

 

It’s actually a good pick, I think Ellis and Toney were also similar sized, JT wasn’t exactly a wee Hagler style 160lber he was a thick set guy, I think he’d beat Ellis though and the guys Toney beat* Rahman and Peter’s probably run over Ellis. JE would be a very high rated p4per today and in any other era with a lot of weight classes and scale manipulation.

 

Yeah there are some actual good match ups at 190-HW that would be shocking for Toney to win, I pick him over Foreman but a guy like LL kills him… a fighter like Bonavena? Fair game. I’d pick Archie Moore to beat Holyfield but Tyson, Bowe and Lewis would delete him.

 

Maybe, skill-wise absolutely but I’m not sure if his physique can support it, tons of roids aside Toney was weirdly comfortable fighting as a fat-ass.

RJJ I think could have been successful via freak athleticism if he sticked around and didn’t move back down.

 

I don’t think we can consider Ellis a middleweight, but yeah him if he counts.

 

Ellis weighed in at 160 or less 12 times. Toney weighed in at 160 or less 15 times. Given Ellis was same day weigh in i cannot see how you can differentiate him from Toney. If anything Ellis was the naturally smaller man. Toney just lacked dedication in a massive sort of way.

 

Also worth noting Toney before he become a boxer was weighing 200 pounds playing American Football.

So Toney was actually Cruiserweight/Heavyweight sized before even becoming a boxer.

 

Agreed with all except Foreman.

Foreman that was getting ready to face Ali likely wins by merciful ref stoppage. Toney bends at the waist and catches punches on the back of the head and neck. His chin is legendary but he ain't built to withstand that type of power to the back of the head.

 

Difference is Ellis made his name and best work at HW, Toney did so at MW / SMW.

 

While that is true, the actual was "could any other middleweight have achieved his success at 190lbs and above?".

Ellis actually achieved more success than Toney at heavyweight. He was within a few months of Toney in the timespan fought at middleweight.

 

I can't see Toney making it to the final bell.

 

Precisely he wasn’t playing Football at 160lbs he was an athlete at roughly 200lbs+ he is cousins with Shaq… but yes his 160lber run to heavyweight isn’t what it seems it’s more like a weight drained 180lbs-190lbs boxer climbing the totem pole lol. Mickey Walker was a real 147-160lber but the heavyweights of his time were cruiser weights of Toney’s… his prime should’ve been 175-190lbs he could’ve been the best cruiser of all time (at the 190lbs bracket) and H2H he probably is.